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Tag Team Pokemon TCG Podcast
Tag Team Pokemon TCG Podcast

Season 1, Episode 11 · 2 years ago

10. The Pidgey Eclipse

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

What is up everybody? Welcome backto tag team. My name is Friley Hobart and I'm joined by my good, good friend JW Curry, Wall Kw. How you doing today, Riley,I'm doing fine. Once again, I'm looking forward to the holiday season. Going to get a chance to go visit family and just relax, enjoysome time together, you know, do all the things that you do onthe holiday season. Love Christmas, so to be some fun coming up here. Yeah, for sure, man. I feel the same. I havethe whole week off for Christmas. I say if my day is up,and I'm just gonna go back to Ohio since oftime my family and relax forthe first time. Right. Well, so that's going to be off right, right, right for that. And I'm sure you're excited for some eggknock as well. I love the Eggnog. I brought in some. Well,my wife brought in some Eggnog for her Christmas party at her work andit was a huge success. And then we had another friend come over acouple days ago. She also had some of the Eggnog from the Party andsaid it was very, very tasty, although the only other time that shehad had homemade eggnog. It had chunks because the tempering process was done cuttoo quickly and brambled some of the eggs. So it's actually a bigot the process. It's a very intricate process. If you want to have like alike a safer Eggnog, and what you do is you heat up the milkand then you add it, like spoonful by spoonful, into the whipped eggyolk mixture. But if you do it too fast then the eggs will cookinto scrambled eggs basically inside your eggnog. So that is very interesting, actuallyvery interesting. So yeah, you'll be my be glad to hear yesterday atwork they had a eggnog French toast. Okay, I'm into it, very, very good. I'm it. Did it taste any different than regular Frenchtoast? Slightly? Yeah, it's definitely comes full difference. Okay, allright, I'm there for it. I'm there for I like French toast,I like Eggnog. I'm just an egg knock guy. So like I'll eator drink like eggnog, milkshakes, I'll drink eggnog, you know, withany type of liqueur. I'll have egg now I mean that egg knock Frenchtoast sounds incredible. I'll just eggnog like kind of whatever way you throw itat me. Yeah, for sure. I think my like holiday seasonal thingthat I really love is I love peppermint flavor. The so like, yeah, graters and Cincinnati Columbus does like peppermint chip or like peppermint stick ice cream, and that's so good. And like chickil a has the shake. That'salso so good. I have a I have a free coupon for a freeshake. A check will like, there you go. You gotta get thepeppermint one to that. Was that rocks? Yeah, no, it is forthe peppermint one. I'm looking forward to eating it. Yeah, thatis or drinking it. Do you drink a milkshake or do you eat amilkshake? I guess it depends how quickly you get to get around to itrelative to why you got it. Yeah, fair enough, like you start byeating it and then and then you drink it at the end. Yeah, that's how I feel usually. Yeah, like you ever have milkshakes, youjust have to, you literally have to spoon them because you can't.Yeah, like all the culvers milkshakes they make them so thick. Yeah,the yeah, custards that they use. Well, anyway, take it awayfrom food. We did have an awesome time this past a weekend at yourholiday get together back in Columbus. It was really nice seeing everybody and wealso got to play some pokmon. We got three play a bunch of cube, which is super cool. Now we can maybe talk about that later,but we did play some standard Pokemon at the VGMX League Cup in Columbus,Ohio. Vjmx kind of a more recent store to come up in Columbus andit's a pretty cool to see the seeing kind of blossom in Columbus. Sadlyafter I leave, maybe related circumstances there. But yeah, nevertheless, we bothattended. And what did we end up deciding to play? JW?Well, we played piggioto control, pigioto control. So you know, Ilanded. It was kind of late in the evening, but we kind ofmold over for a while exactly what we wanted to do. We talked quitea bit about the list and the cards that would come in and out ofit. What would you say was like notable about the list that we play? What made it good? Why do we settle on something like the pigeoncontrol of the nation that we've played? I would just say that the listwas very, I don't know, straightforward, very consistent, optimized for just gettingthe strong turn one, specifically optimized for getting the turn one elms.So we included the full count of Elms,...

...the full count of poker gear andthen one card that not a lot of people always include as a Maxcount of the acro bikes, which right I loved recently. Now We'd playedit without Geraci, so that would be like the next like consistency card thatyou could either add or substitute in the place of acro bike, but inany case we went the full, like trainer route of maximized consistency to tryto get that turn one attack off. Beyond that, I don't know thatthere was anything really unique to the our list. We took out a lotof the unusual texts that you might see, things like apps. All we didn'tplay. I'm trying to think of other we did go back to mewand Bruggad bonds, though, which has yeah that much. Sure, sure, that's true. So we were expecting a lot of things like Tina chomp. You Know Tina chomp. Just their spread damage turn after turn can bereally devastating to your board, especially if you have kind of a slow starts. We were thinking, okay, maybe the mew from unbroken bonds could helpassuage some of the difficulty with that card as it's being played in its owndeck and it's also seeing some play in the Malmar decks. But yeah,it was, I thought, just a very strong call for the weekend.I ended up hitting some either bad matchups or kind of awkward things, butI thought overall we had a really good and strong sixty cards. It justdidn't work out for us. Yeah, yeah, neither of US ended upmaking top eight, sadly. I did quite like the list that we had. Maybe we can share that unlike the tag team, twitter or something,so people can take a gander at that end decide for themselves that they likeit. I would I would agree with your analysis. So it was kindof straightforward. It was designed to get the term one elms to turn twoelms and then plow through the deck. We played to Hoppooz, which reallyhelped to accelerate through the deck and I definitely noticed that as we played itto. Yep, that was a very nice boost to the digging potential.No cute cards like will or anything, but didn't really feel like they weresuper necessary. Lasting here, I think for the sub on twitch ten months. That's awesome, man. Think you so much for the support. Yeah, I mean I really like piggy control right now in the format. Ithink it's a pretty good deck and I I am always like surprised, Iguess, when people say that they think control doesn't have the time to finish, because we finished all of our games and you know, obviously some ofthose were losses, but we finished like close games and what I felt wasa comfortable amount of time. Even one game in particular, I'm thinking of, where I kind of berated you for playing slowly, you still didn't evenhit time, and that game, right, there's actually several minutes after you finishedit. So right, right. So, like, I just wantto reiterate, as I've said several times now, that I think like stallstrategies are perfectly viable and like the best of one thirty minutes. It didn'treally feel like time was ever an oppressive factor or sir suing that like wascausing a hindrance to me? True. Yeah, I don't know. Ifeel like people, if you're if you think time is a problem, youprobably just haven't practice enough, because you're you're spending too much time and thinkingabout what you have to do right right, or you're kind of maybe making decisionsthat are optimized for the turn that you're on. So I found myselfdoing this a lot too. Is like in the mid game I would begetting back cards that I'd actually just want for like a couple prizes in thefuture. Like I found myself just putting back in like chip chips, whichisn't necessarily a bad play, but when you're in the early and mid game, you kind of want to you know, you'd rather have, I feel,those supporters like Hapu and stuff just into the deck to make sure thatyou can plow through, and then you're kind of setting up to just dothe Big Combo when there at you know, three or two, one prize,that kind of that kind of thing. So even I find myself kind ofdoing some unusual plays with the deck. I was tilted in one of therounds where I prized tild it. Yeah, I prized to water energy, and so I had no access to articuno and it was a matchup.It was a fire blow cephalon matchup that I really would have loved to havethe art the articuno access. Didn't have it and then ended up making justsome weird plays. Loss was to a dark box, which was really sadbecause I prized a copy of the stadium that we played, the Poe Jrland, the power plant. So I couldn't chain those backto back. AndI know the list that she plays plays a ton of stadiums. I thinkit's something like to Veridian, to night city or dark city. Maybe it'slike reefridian and too dark city, something like that, just like for four, maybe five stadiums in her list which make it very difficult. And thenobviously she plays the red and blue, so being able to search out theyou know, search out the the energies...

...from the deck makes it really hardas well. So prizing that stadium was really tough because I could never quiteget the lock and then I couldn't hold the lock. Even if I didget the lock, she was able to break out of it, which isreally tough. So not going to you know, not to say like that. I couldn't have one. I guess it was just really tough with andthen she had two copies of the Um, two copies of the Gus Lord.That takes two prizes every time it goes for a knockout. So Iwas able to mill one of them, I couldn't quite get to the nextone and that one just, you know, ran me out of a rang gurusand ended up winning the game for her. So, like she playedit perfectly, very very well. I just wasn't able to put enough pressureon to take the DUB. Yeah, yeah, I feel that for sure. My loss is typically it came down to one game. I had tonot chip, chip for one turn and they got a reset stamp after Iit was like I probably could have been angled this better, but the waythat I played the cards out, which I think I probably misplayed at least, like one turn out of that game I had to Missy and Lore liediscard a ridiculous amount of cards, obviously, and then the next turn I gotracists tipped to decked out and it felt so bad because, like Iwasn't even thinking about that being an option until right after I'd Dis Sea andLaura led and I'm like yeah, Geez, you are. You were pretty salty. I was a little salty, I'm not gonna lie, but myopponent like saw the out and like props of them for, you know,continue to play when the odds were stacked against them too, because they hadno energy left, as far as I know, like I honestly thought thatthey had begun to run out of energy at turn earlier than they did,because they were playing the lucariom metal and didn't grab an energy off the themetal fist. I think, like whatever grabs the energy at the deck andI'm like, Oh, you know, he's out of out of metals,like he only has these three energy left. That is like that's a fine amount, because he can't Koll my dudes. Unfortunately, he did have that lastmetal, which kind of like threw me for a loop. Yeah,so I think just like multiple turns of like me not not fully like comprehendingwhat was going on. happened. They're right, and I was like forMoon. I was really upset because I could have played a pal pad andlike gone up, but then I thought we were talking just now and I'mlike well, wait, if I played the pal fad I would have gonedown a four and then up to six. Oh, that's right, it isstill once. So, like it's whatever. It was just a mess, so it's whatever. Stuff happens. It was still really fun. Myother loss was just to a fire deck. I wasn't drawing super well, soI only one pigey on board most of the game and then I withthe Chit turn, chip, chip, and they topped that of fire energyto knock out my Macaputerson for game. Yeah, it just it feels likea deck are our performances were kind of on the is, on that wrongside of variant where you just you know, if, like you said, ifthey don't draw that one card on that one turn, then like,you probably win the game handily or like. If they don't do that one thing, if they don't have that one stadium on that one turn, thenyou know, you probably win. Unfortunately, just didn't go like that for us. Yeah, still would consider piggy to be extremely viable deck. Idon't think that there were was anything in the room that I was necessarily afraidof facing, besides maybe that dark box. I just had a ton of stadiums. But even then I think there are ways if you like played thematchup out, you know, a ton of times, like I think youstill end up favorable in that matchup. I just don't think that there wasnecessarily anything in the room that I was saying. Man, I hope Idon't play against that. Yeah, I mean I think it was a prettygood call for that tournament, just like on a conceptual level. Yeah,there wasn't a ton like even I really can't even think of anything I wouldbe that scared of that was in the room. Like mute. She's probablyone of the scarier matchups just because how fast they can like get the gamemoving, and there wasn't really a lot of that. Right. I'm notreally scared of Malam or anything, so it felt fine. I'm pigie definitelyhas, I feel, like the control decks in general, or a littlemore suspective variance sometimes, because you're playing cards like hammers and you know youhave like the flips and doll stall and like there's all sorts of weird stuff. I can just go wrong, sure, and you only have to you know, you're only playing two ups. So like you could easily prize.Yeah, it was, or or even worse, like you could never havethe chance to play them because you have like, you know, a bunchof your pidgie lines or prize of the pigeon. Yeah, yeah, forsure. So actually, one of the Games I won what I prize,like three vigiotors or something ridiculous like that. But I did have like such aridiculous bill off of Bill Elpha that look like a possible for my opponentalwind, no better what. So it's like a Turd to below, though, just like I got nothing else, but it slawam and I milled likesome of their most important cards to win...

...the match. Brood Dude, that'spretty funny. But yeah, it felt really good also to be back inColumbus and playing cards with some what the people I've known for a while.So I've had a great time, even if the tournamenting goes as well asI would have hoped, and honestly, I would probably take this sixty twoanother cup easily on a different day. Yeah, maybe with a little moretime to practice and a little more sleep than night before, but I woulddefinitely consider playing it again. I don't know if there's anything else that evenreally on my radar that I want to bring the cups at this point.Sure what you're feeling? Well, I would say that I'm going to behonest. You know, Malamar performed really well that weekend, I think,taking two of the Ohio Cups. Yeah, and and so you have to lookat Malamar and just say, Hey, you know, we've kind of beendissing it for the longest time, but maybe it's just that Perfect Cupdeck. I mean Alamar has all season been the cup monster. Yeah,yeah, absolutely, I would say, you know from memory just just thatit's locked, locked down. You know at least a dozen that I canjust think. I'm off my head Cup wins, which is pretty strong forfor that deck. So I would say, you know, Malamar, I woulddefinitely consider taking that to a cup like it's one, at least ona cup level, and it's kind of fun when it rolls. So definitelyit's fun of what it works, I will say. Yeah, so thatwould be another deck on my radar. The lasting but not least, ismewtwo. I mean still going to be that strong contender for the entirety ofat least this format. So definitely considering me too. If I were togo to another cup in the next few weeks, but those probably be mytop three at the moment. Yeah, I wou'd say if it wasn't Piggy, I would look towards I still kind of want to try ATP even thoughI rag on it a lot. I just kind of want to try it, have it in my hands at a cup. It just seems like kindof fun, even if you get your strategy actually going, it seems prettyfun. And I would also probably playing Alamar as like a third choice aswell. We both were talking about this after the Cup and actually even beforethe Cup we were kind of talking like hey, you know, I'm Alamarmight be an option, and we're like no, no, no, let'sjust not resign ourselves of playing Alamar and then Lamar and at up winning theCup that we were at. Yeah, and so we're kind of like yeah, up winning and it I don't think it really had that much representation.It was like two people. I was going to say there weren't that manypeople. I think it only had one placement, a top eight. Sojust just going to show that, you know, it's really not on alot of people's radar or at least in my local metagame. Yeah, soit's kind of surprised me because, like, Columbus has historically been like a veryMalamar Centurya. HMM. Yeah, so, you know, that's that'show the cookie crumbles. I malmars like a deck I am less inclined toplay just because of makes it kind of anxious and also, just like sleevein those suckers up just feels kind of bad and of itself. Like you, just like you have, you have such like a negative reaction to itfrom the past that it may be hard for us at this point, likeare the Milin of our brain has us that Malamar's bad and like we can'tplay it. So we get repulse anytime we see Malamar. I mean,don't get me wrong. To you, like I've stand malmore more so thanyou have. I think like I was right. I was Super Intovoutmar fromworld, which was I think would have been a bad choice. But nownow to go beyond this format. Obviously we're getting a new set in acouple months. Do you think Malamar gets better with, you know, withthe new set at all? This is like kind of tangentially related, butdo you think that Malamar continues to be, you know, this cut, thisvery like decent, maybe very strong, local Cup deck, or does itget way better to the point that we may start seeing it perform ityou know well, on the regional level. I think there's like pluses and minesthat are going to come with Malmar. Like the Quick Ball, I thinkit is, and evolutionary incense are both really good. I think thoseare the cards that malmars looking at from sword and shield, so obvious assets. They're just being able to set up better is all that Malmar really wants. And your quick ball is kind of like another set of treasures that youcan throw in your deck. Almost I can't grab them Olmar, but itcan grab your in Gaze, which almost are more important to grab. SoI do like that, but I don't think it really gains a lot inthe in the way of like attackers or like options. It just feel likedo the Strategi already just better. And...

...the reason that concerns me is thatit also gets like the Sycamore supporter, which is super good for Malmar,and thank you to Keel for the for the bits. The thing that concernsme, though, is that there's now these really viable, insanely high hpPokemon, where Maltmore is now like three hitk owing them pretty naturally, evenlike with spell tags and stuff, you know, with those v Max has, and so that's that seems rough to me, especially if they utilize likemountain Lana and stuff. I'm thinking stuff like the like the Lappers v Max. I could see that being played for sure, with the frost moth.Yeah, Snore Lax v Max could also see play. It's just like it'shard to tell. I and I hate to like theorym on that far aheadto because the game is like fundamentally change and going into sword and shield right, right, exactly, and that's I mean, it's interesting, right,because we've said for the long time like that is why Malamar maybe isn't bestsuited for this format, because you just have these huge tag teams that canheal with Malowe Lana. But that hasn't really deterred and actually we've seen theMalamar list evolved and adapt. I think the most notable inclusion in Malamar ithas been just a big tag team of its own, be it Lunala andso goalleo or, I think more popularly, the Guiarantina guard chop tag team andjust both those being able to deal that big damage to kind of getover the Hump, be able to take, you know, what would have beenmaybe a two or three shot by a Malmar into one shot. Yeah, yeah, I mean those are all definitely factors. It's I think Malamar'sa really hard deck to call, but it's almost feel also feels like animpossible deck to ever write out, if that makes sense. Like, Idon't want to attest to Malmar being one of the best decks in the format, but I wouldn't I would not say it's like unviable or anything like thateither, because prol Mars is one of those decks that always clause its wayfrom whatever pit it's trapped in into being a good, viable deck sure,or at least good enough, you know, for the haters out there. Absolutelycool. Well, let's move on from Malamar discussions into something new.I don't know what we talk about now. Well, I mean I gotta saythe cosmic clips format kind of burned self pretty quick, not because itwas inherently a bad format, although I wasn't a huge fan of it,but just because, like a lot happened with it in a very short time. So like we plowed through events. Now there's like nothing left in Godsmkeclubs standard, but I do think there's a ton of he had and shoutout to the tricky gimmers that raid there. The expanded format, I think,has a lot to be explored still, and I mean now we're in apost band world. You and I've been talking quite a bit about likewhat we want to bring to Dallas coming up. That's going to be ahuge tournament. I'm really excited for that. Yeah, so what does the futurehold in that regard? Like we could look towards Sword Shield all wewant, but I don't think we can really predict yet. But expanded isjust around the corner and I know, I hope you love expanded jw becauseit's good, it's gracious. You're the most recent expanded rigional channel, orwell, second most recent, second most recent. Yes, yes, yes, don't don't forget. I can never forget Ian Rob because he just SKand robs specially our deck. Yeah, but yeah, no, second timeand rob is destroyed my death right. Yeah, exactly, exactly. Yeah, shout outs to Natalie Um but yeah, I think there are six vible deckthat I'm really looking at breaking down in the expanded format. I don'tknow that they're going to turn out to be, you know, the sixtier one decks, although I do believe a lot of them are very strong. I just think these are kind of the six decks that I initially goto as being the best deck of the expanded format and I think they willprobably be some of the most played in Dallas. And so I've been sayingthis for a while, but I think Guardian, mew three, Altnacrosma Zoro, garb, dark box and the Humpty dumpty vileplume deck. I think thoseare the six decks that I'm looking to initially and saying they have a lotof strengths. They do a lot of things really, really well. Theymaybe were archetypes in the past that continue to be viable and maybe even getbetter with the loss of the stall decks. Yeah, and they, you know, for a lot of these they gained something, you know, verycool from the most recent set. So for those reasons, I think thesesix decks are the kind of the ones that I'm going on to the ladderand testing with friends and telling people that I think most of them are goingto be good plays. It's just kind of figuring out the best play.Yeah, and the best list as well. I know you and I both arevery much fans of for finding down lists, to the nitty gritty piecesof it, but probably why we work...

...so well together when it comes todecks. Sure. So let's go one by one then. I think thefirst one that comes to mind for me, and one that we talked quite abit about this past weekend, would be this oral garb archetype. Youknow, just came off a win in Portland with Ian Rob and overall,I think continues to just be a strong deck and every single expanding format thatwe've seen in the post, like red card, hex world. Talk tome a little about your thoughts on the Zoor Guard, but you told meand before the screen that you're not super into it. It feels kind ofmediocre. I have some thoughts that I'd love to to speak to you onthat, but I want to I want to hear your side first. Pillsor garb is definitely a deck that I feel I could be, you know, on one side of the bed one day and the other side the otherday where it could flip flop between being this kind of average deck that Idon't see a lot of potential in to being, you know, the TierOne archetype that can take any single deck down. And unfortunately recently I've justbeen on the wrong side of that and saying, you know, did sometesting on on twitch and on my channel and just kind of seeing the deckperform in action. I was losing a lot to things that play garbodor.I was losing, you know, to alter acrosma stuff that would just beable to use an ATP and I couldn't dig for my ranger fast enough andthen they'd be able to one shot Zor arcs and then I'd be in thisreally awkward position. Not Good Right, because they'd have the garbodor up andit was just like wow, I should conceptually be able to destroy this deck, like I have ranger in my deck. I should be able to, youknow, do some tricky things, you know, maybe Faba their energyor kill their garbodor and like end them low and maybe they're out of energyor things like that. But it was never that easy and I kind ofgot down on myself on the dead deck. I think again, it's always goingto be inherently decent. I'm just not sure what the format shaving upif it has what it takes to be the winning deck, like the bestdeck in the format. Yeah, I think that's a pretty good summary whatI kind of alluded to. We've talked about this a lot in person nowis is or Garve always feels not mediocre, but it's like you have to tryharder to win. It feels like then a lot of decks. It'snot necessarily a bad thing all the time. No, it's just like it doesn'tfeel it as good. In my opinion, it's some other never nevercontrols the game from start to finish. I've I've found like there's usually likea turn, and especially now with these decks, like there's usually a turnwhere it's like if I don't hit it here, like if I don't hitit off this end, then I'm in a really bad spot. It justnever can control the pace of the game the way like a turbo dark can, where they can pop off from turn one and you basically just know you'regoing to win the game. It's just kind of going through the motions,just attack right or going to thing like vio plum. Right you get upthe Item Lock Vio Plume and your opponent doesn't have a board presence and thenyou know, okay, I'm I'm going to have the time I need tobuild up an attacker and just win. It doesn't have that strength from beginningto end, although what it loses in the early game I think it doesmake up for in the lake game. You do have a lot of optionsto lock your opponent in the lake game we think of the GARBOTOX and garbodor. Think I'm just end being a very strong card. You're more able todraw out of a lake game end. So it does have some things thatgo for it in the lake game, but it's just kind of getting tothat lake game that's always the issue. Yeah, as or garb always feelslike kind of a an exploration into like routing your game plan and prize mappingand, you know, getting to end game board states, whereas you know, you play stuff like turbo dark and you're hey, well, you know, it's turn one. Let's figure out what we can do use our garbs. Turn one, like most impressive turn one you can have. Is likebench a couple basic poker I like maybe shaming at the end of it,like right. So, yeah, it's just an even like I don't know. I'd Dec I like Guardian. I think Guardian is another good play thatalso feels has this like feeling of inevitability. Yeah, you know, where ifyou can get that magical miracle for six probably you know going to winlike eighty percent of the games, right that that happens or something like that. It just it has this kind of inevitable feeling where if you can justget to that win condition, then you know you're then you're going to win. And whereas garbodors or arc is like, you know, what can you thinkis like the ideal board, you know, having like fors ORC outand maybe the garbotoxin down. But even then it gets kind of weird becauselike shut off your own abilities, and I don't it is there's a lotof things like going on. For sure, there's a lot of things that aregoing on in a lot of things that are connterintuitively. Yeah, yeah, for sure. I mean I think...

...probably my favorite deck right now isstill turbo dark. It's just, you know, I love the UNGABUNGA strategyof just going ham with the elixirs in the patches term one and saying youknow what you got, man, yeah, answer me, like you figure thisout. What can you do in response to that? I think that'sjust like a strategy that'll always see some modicum of success because it's just sostraightforward and so powerful and it's asking such like important questions of your opponent,you know, like being able to one shot a tag team on turn to. It can't ever be that bad, right, like it can't be terrible. So if any of you have any additional thoughts on on turbo dark orwhy it might be a good or bad play, well again, I meanturbo dark was really good last format, so I think it just maintains itsstrength. It kind of beat everything. I don't see too much, toomany new decks coming out of US cosmic eclipse aside from, you know,aside from the alternate acrossma deck. I mean there are new decks that willcome out of cosmic eclipse, but in my initial kind of testing, inmy initial views on you know, tcg Oh and just my experiences, Idon't really see a lot of the new cards making brand new archetypes outside ofalternate acrosma, but even then I think dark box can handle that deck,you know, for the most part. Again, I need to do somespecific testing of that match up, but there's nothing really that I'm scared of. If I look through the list of like possible options, there wasn't reallythat much that turbot arc was scared of last format and I don't believe thatthere's anything new that it should be scared of. Yeah, so let's actuallyshift focus then. You've talked about they're not being a ton of new decksbesides ulternate ACROSSMA. I mean, I think we've talked a lot about theseexisting decks and I don't think they transform and a significant enough way to reallytwo for there to be much new information there. But the new deck,I think that is truly interesting. The people is this altern acrosma deck withthe baby oltn ACROSMA has that ability which prevents it from attacking unless your opponentas at too or less prizes. But you know, they are all sourcesof ways and expanded to turn offf abilities, including but not limited to garbodor muckand silent lab, all sorts of very effective ways to be able totack the Oulternate Cross were doing one hundred and seventy four two and discarding ofenergy off your opponent, like just Cuz I guess right, that's pretty good. That's pretty good, they ought to say. And you compare that easilywith ATP. You can just leave it solo. There's all sorts of wayswe're seeing that be played. Yeah, my personal problem with that strategy.I think it's pretty good. There are actually two things I don't like aboutit. The first thing that bothers me is that pokemon ranger as a card, as a card that people like love to throw in their deck randomly.It appears in all sorts of like aggressive turbo we kind of decks and orlike so arc decks. Just throw it in just because they can turn outtrade away if you don't want it. So makes me a little anxious becauseyou're playing like an ATP focus build and they pokemon ranger. You then youwasted an ATP and an attachment and an attack and now you're like, well, I guess I probably lose now. Huh? So, yes, yeah, well, I would just counter that to say that the alternate ACROSMA canput so much pressure on that a ranger in a lot of cases doesn't rightmatter. So it's like it depends on the situation, obviously you know,and it depends on like your board state and how often they're able to goosemy but there's another thing that I don't like us well, which is thefact that there's a lot of pieces to chain if your opponent is putting pressureon you. So, like you know, I think the deck is very vulnerablesituations where you get your pokemon knocked out, you get end to alowhand size and now you have to find usually, I think the ULTRAMATECROSMA DECreally likes to gust. So you have to find a gust card, andI know they're playing like great catchers and stuff to help with that, butstill you have to find a gust card, a pokemon hopefully have on the benchand another energy attachment of which you only played for so that's a kindof a tall ask. You know, it's not necessarily easy to find allthat immediately, especially if you get ends to one or two and you like, well, I have to find this like three very specific cards. AndYeah, totally. I mean I think that lists will start to modify themselvesto, you know, be able to counter that I mean I'm thinking ofthings like teammates going in the deck that...

I haven't really seen many I meanteammates is an obvious inclusion, right, for the Special Energy One prize decks. Right, right, I think so. But I just just saying, likethe decks will adapt the things that I'm seeing now, and even theinitial concept that I had of the list was maybe a little bit more focusedon Goosemanhala, whereas I think, you know, playing it more, Isee that the build that I initially had is very clearly not the eerier build, and so I do find that the garbodor yeah limits you in that wayof, you know, getting end you're a little more susceptible to a lagame and whereas a mock artillery Combo can give you that additional draw power thatyou need at the end of the game. So it'll be very interesting to seehow that deck and changes over time, because I do think it is thedeck that a lot of people say, Oh yeah, you know, youput ultrain acrossman garbodor together like it makes the perfect pair. And andyes, they're very good together. However, there are other ways to build itand I don't believe and the initial stage of testing that the Garbo orvariant is far and away the best variants of play. Right. I meanthere's tradeoffs, right. So, like the mock is the most consistent wayto turn off your ability and you can have access to other things. Samething with silent lab. They have evolved abilities. But then the trade sideis your opponent, namely your Zark. Opponent, will have access to theirevolved abilities and know also stuff like Guardian will have access their involved abilities onthe Romantis. But mock artillery is definitely something I would personally be a fanof because of stuff like an you know you cannot. You can't so easilytake advantage of ending your opponent. But either way I think there's some kindof build to make it work better than I think it has so far.Leaning hard into Sycamore and teammates might be the way to go and just havingcatchers and never using goosemo or Liz Sander. But even then there's like there's stilla lot that can go wrong when you have a basic deck like basic, non gx, special energy focused deck like that and it doesn't necessarily haveone shot. Says one shots on Shaman's and den a's and that's like andLa, which basically a loss and less play by the day, it feelslike. But then it doesn't want shot like gx is or stuff like nightmarch. You're kind of similar in some ways. Like you have you're doinga lot of damage. If you're using the special energy attachment. You're aone prize attacker, but you're one hit kowing things no matter what's in theactive so it's like I think they have an interesting like balance there between what'sthe good good and what's the better one prize play. Actually think night Marchmight have a significant or like be a force to be reckoned with and it'snew metagame, because they don't think a lot of people are really thinking aboutit and being able to one shot things. Yeah, it's always nice, right. I think problem, though, I feel like the comfort pick willbe's or garbodor for a lot of players, and then I think that, youknow, the obvious inclusion ins or garbodor is just a one of ourChoreo. Sure. So I'm not too sure how big night march will bein this format, but you do have a point that you know it's notbeing talked about. It always seems to resurface and due the best when it'skind of under the radar. So we'll see if, if night march doesin fact show up in spades. Well, another thing to consider is, like, you know, stuff like night march. It thrivees obviously when peoplearen't prepared for it. And right, you know, stuff like Zoro garbis pretty tight, unlike the cars that you can include, like if youhave a you do a lot with the deck, but you know, youcan only fit so many text and if they have to choose between like techingfor ultern acrosma, attacking for a night march going to this event, whichwould you think the person, I mean more likely to choose? I thinkwould be alternate ACROSSMA. I would agree. Yes, so I don't know.It's like it's kind of interesting how all that like adds up to howit deck might do well or or not. Any is anything else that like jumpsout to you specifically from cosmic a? Yeah, yeah, there is justone second jolly Flim that you know, night March has a bad alternate acrossmatch up. Yeah, I mean I would say so. Right,if they use the ATP then they can still outpace you, because you knowif they use ATP on the first turn and then even if you're able toknock out the ATP, which I'm not even sure how you would, letwars what's that? Electriferis? Oh, yeah, with electric powers. Evenif you knock at the ATP, then they could still go knock on,knock on, knockout consecutively and win that prize trade. So yes, unlessthey have the ranger in their night march, they will likely lose to the alternateacrossma that plays ATP, although if they if the ranger, knock atATP in the same turn, you'd instantly lose. Yes, would be veryfunny. That would be insane. Yes,...

...that would be very funny and crazy. I would love to see that and I'm sure there will be agame like that on stream in Dallas. But the other thing that kind ofjumps out to me is that I do think mew three will be a gooddeck for the tournament. It gains a lot with the with the decline ofthe Zoric control deckx. I think that's just a deck and that might alsoagain be meet saying I want this deck to be good, but I doreally believe that mew two was in a good spot last format, but itjust got hated out by things like you know, or control specifically. Justwas too much to overcome. And so mew three seems to be a deckthat I would be comfortable telling people to play, something I'd be comfortable playingand something that I think just is a now a more viable deck than itwas last format. And then I think plume retains its power. I thinkit stays this strong deck. I don't think a lot of people will bethinking about it heading into the regional you know, with with alternate across onbeing, I think, the new hype, I think a lot of people kindof sleep a little bit on plume. I'm about this. There might bepeople that are taking for plume. I've seen a lot of WAYBA FETTand I've include WHYBA FETT in my list to try to help out with theitem lock, something that we didn't see last format. But I do thinkvioplume will maintain its place as as a good choice. Yeah, I meanif our plume really struggled as well against those control decks which are fading out. I don't think it has the best stor or guard matchup, but certainlymore winnable in some of these control matchups. That's for that's for Dank. Sure. I also really do like changing up kind of the way we've seenyou too, with stuff like a lot penny now existing. You can playcards like Gooseman Halla and even just like a couple DC's Ryan being able toreally there's the problem I had primarily with you two is that it had alot of trouble dealing with stuff like darker Ey that gets set up too fast. Is One shots you round, but if you just throw a megalotle Puneyin this card, you grab a DC in a D valley, you're probablygoing to one shot the dark rights in the active. Yeah, yeah,the cool thing through is that you can do things like, if you playa more dce focused build, you can play things like seisman toad, whichyou know is basically like Noi burn, and then to also make it,you know, make an easier snipe attack, you have access to snipy and MinosaurGx, which cool card that you know, for one energy attachment youcan do fifty two other whole bench. So ideally, you know, theZoro Guard player could lose their entire bench in one turn when I would beunfortunately, very, very strong. I'd be unfortunate for them, for sure. Yeah, I think there's a lot of clever new tricks that can comeout of having DC as an option. Now, and especially you don't evenhave to run for if you don't want to, if you have Guzman Hollandout of like consistently grab that out of the deck whenever you want it.Right. Absolutely, I'm personally excited to see. I'm you, two evolves, for that was a deck that was really fun and really interesting strategically toplay. So I'm sure there's all sorts of cool things that people will try, and I'm sure that will try quite a few of them as well,because we will stay im Youtwo in this jet. We we do, andboth formats for his kind of we're kind of shills for me too. Yeah, that's right. Cool. Well, I think that's a pretty good primeron where we are expanded right now. I think that was the only othertopic we really wanted to directly address today, so we will open up the floortwo questions here before we do that. Jw Know, I did want toprior preemptively announce that we do have this tag team twitter account, thistag team Pokemon, I believe it is on twitter, and on Christmas Daywe are not going to be doing a podcast, but instead we will bedoing a giveaway. So we launching a giveaway on our twitter. What you'llneed to do? We are still figuring out the card. We believe thatwe have the card, but we're going to be giving away some very rareexpensive card as long as you were tweet and follow our twitter. Just goingto be something fun to kind of drive some engagement and just get the communityinvolved just give away something on Christmas. So we think that will be areally fun way to to do that. Yeah, so giving it away.All you have to do is like retweet and follow the account and then you'llenter to win one of these really cool full art what do we say,Riley? What do we say? Well, we don't want to lock it inand sentence stone yet, but we know we're looking at we're looking ata couple cards and I think I think the fans like it. So sobe on the look out for that. Do Follow the account. That's thebest way to keep in a loop as far as what's going on and thingsgoing to be doing and I think in the future will use that as aif we get more followers, that as...

...sort of a question submission mechanism,so we can tweet a couple days ahead of time and you all can posethose questions that you want answered during the week's cast. So yeah, Ithink overall it serves to benefit everyone here if we drive engagement there, becauseI think it will allow us to create the content that best suits your needs. Yeah, absolutely, and it's always great to have people submit con submitquestions in the chat, but sometimes there are topics that we didn't even considerthat would have been really good to actually dive a little bit deeper into duringthe podcast. So yeah, just having that outlet to be able to saythose a little bit earlier is always great. We have one question from Nikil.Earlier in the stream he says, are you guys excited for the Vcards and vmax cards, or are you sick and tired of three prizers?Yeah, I can start on that. I don't really have a problem withthree frisers as much as some people that spokenly do, as I think whatwill really determine how good of a format is is if is like the varietyof strategies. That's all that really matters to me, whether that's one Prizor three prisor for Friser, and I think tag team actually did have agood variety of strategies that were cool and interesting and viable. Whether or notthe vmax format will maintain that seems to remain to be seen, but Ilike how you evolve the v Max has. That's a little more interesting than tagteams just being slammed on the board. It's sure. The only thing Ireally don't like is how the Regular v's are basically just x is again. Yeah, because I thought X is were much more underwhelming mechanic than gxhas. Right, right, absolutely, you know, at least, especiallyto go back to that, you know. So are you excited for vs JW? I mean I think the V cards are cool. I think thethree prize deck, three prize attackers lend themselves very well the competitive play inthat you know, you only have thirty minutes in a cup or in achallenge to player matches. So I just think that being able to finish amatch a little bit on the quicker side. Never I mean, you know,the longer the game goes, the more room there is to make misplaysor two out player opponent. But I do believe that with the three prizersit will and it has, I feel, like, accelerated the strength and thegrowth of the game just in general from like an entry level standpoint tothe point that I think they're good for the game, even if they makethe games easier. We've seen that they haven't completely like destroyed the stall mechanics. Stall still very good. Those, I think those types of stratgy shewill always be good and be things that people can play. But I personallylike the three prizes. I think they're very good from a competitive play standpoint. Hey Man, team, yell, let's go. That'd be fun.Yeah, I mean we're I don't know, it's kind of a we're in anera of still expansion from an HP standpoint. Somebody brings up I washoping we'd get to three hundred fifty HP stage two's and like we're not doneyet, right, like it's not over yet. Let's keep going. Haveto be. They have to be like the highest HP pokemon like ever,right, because you can't. I could never see them going like the vmaxplus or something and it's just like double the size of emacs that just nowwe're getting ridiculous. What if things like you combine two cards together, giveslike six prizes and has six hundred health? There's something that would be crazy.I like, I don't know, maybe that mechanic could be good if, like it said, you can't bench anymore pokemon or like you can't havea bench. You know. So you're just against this one, dude,but it just still sounds so wrong that. Does somebody mess up? That wouldbe kind of cool, though, if there's just like some pokemon cardthat was insanely powerful, but you can't have a bench while you have itand like maybe maybe even like part of the abilities, just like you pluckit out of your deck when you start and like throw out in the activity. Don't Mulg in a million times. Yeah, that sounds like it bekind of whatever. That's I'll ask you here. I ask, considering howquickly people lose interest in formats, could the world outside Japan support the Japanrelease schedule of a set or mini st every month? Thoughts? I thinkthat's fine, I although I would contest like the beginning of that saying,considering how quickly people lose interest in formats. I don't know if that's necessarily thecase for for me, he I think there have been formats that I'vehad a sustained interest in four months at...

...a time. But yes, Ido feel like I'm in a lull right now. So I'm going to bebiased and say like, of course I would want more mini sets to kindof spice things up, but I don't think it's quite so bad is asmaybe the question is painted it to be, although I will agree. I meanI always love an influx of new cards, always love an influx ofnew strategies, so I'd support it. Yeah, I don't. It's likekind of weird because we get such massive sets right now that it gives usa lot to work with and I think that theoretically, that formats could lasta while and there's still more to be discovered. I think part of itis how the tier two events and up are or organized. So if they'reall on one end of the format, that's typically when the most development inthe format will happen, just because that's when the most hot players are workingon their decks and showing them on the largest stage, serving us to seethem. I don't really think that a bunch of mini sets really solves anything, because it just all that really does is dilute the quality of each individualset, right like instead of getting you two and macart or and spond theaxis and all that stuff and one say, it would be split out over liketwo or three sets and would just make each individual set kind of underwhelmingand feel kind of weird, at least with how we currently structured it.So at I don't really think it would solve anything to have like more compowerdepartmentalized breakdowns. If anything, it would just make it harder to be aconsumer and player. He's you have to keep up with so much all thetime. Yeah, that's the other part right. That is just more cardsmeans more expense to the player. I mean they could maybe, like,maybe, like you alluded to, not make the set so big to beginwith and then release like a mini set later. But you know, we'llsee. We'll see what happens. I would support it, but there aredefinitely pros and constable. So we'll take two more questions. There's one Iwould like to hit on, or not really question, but a comment.PK Bubble says that POKEMON V seem balance right now, but I'm afraid itwill turn into tag teams or of started balance then took over the format.I don't know when. To you that peak ram seemed balanced, but Ithink tag teams started off pretty broken. Yeah, I mean I think therewas like I think when they say balance, they're were really referring to like therewere evolution decks, one prize evolution dex. I think specifically of adeck like wheezing, which that sucks it well, yeah, but you know, it's still existed in the same format and you know I've had that's notthe fault of the Polke tag teams either. It's the fault of like we didn'thave any way to search out one frisers or any weakness checks. Likeit's not like the tag teams were designed and such an incredibly broken way relativeto the original ones. It's like sure, we just have no checks to them. And Right now, sure, yeah, I mean it's interesting.Right. And for the last question of the night. Three VOTV ASS.Do you feel dark dragons or turbo dark is better suited for the current Metaand expanded and have you guys done any testing comparing the two? I haveonly tested turbo dark. I feel like it is extremely strong. Dark dragonsfeels good from a conceptual standpoint. I just am curious as to whether ornot it is as streamlined. Obviously it's not going to you know, you'retrying to fit in more things, so it's not going to be as consistent. So that would be the biggest thing that would worry me about dark dragons. Obviously that has like a more strong potential, but you're risking the alreadylike and turbo dark is already strong. So you're kind of taking away someof the just inherent strength of the consistency of turbo dark and putting it intoother things that make it maybe a bit stronger but less consistent. So Iwould say stick with turbo dark. If you're finding that that deck is strugglingin the things that you're playing against are the things of your friends are playingagainst her in your local Meta, then maybe start to look into dark dragons. But I don't really think that dark dragons adds anything that turbot dark can'thandle by itself. Yeah, I am inclined to agree. And also darkdragons makes me a little anxious because all the things that really make dragons specialand good. I'm thinking of Guarantina and ATP, are both get bodied byranger, which people are already looking at putting in their decks. And soat that point, why not just play a more consistent version that I'll hateyour Max lilixers every time, which I love doing that. Yeah, thecounter to that, is it right? Is like you use your ATP,use the GX attack, and then you're immediately set up. If they don'twant shy you, you're immediately set up to just start accelerating energies and thenat the point that you can accelerate energies, you're you know, you're going togo buck wild with how much stuff...

...you have on the field. Sothat would be kind of the car counter arguments way yours, and I meanI see that and I does that to you. As well. As atthe ATP can accelerate the darks, which is like so cool, but youknow you're hitting maxlixers less. You have to find these dark you're just doubledragon energies, which isn't that big of a challenge, but still, whereasyou could, instead of gx attacking with ATP turn one, you just knocksomething out and so instead of winning the game in two attacks after an ATPGX, you can win it in either two attacks or three attacks excluding the ATPGX. So right. So what's the point? I guess. Right exactly, youknow, like ATP doesn't change the amount of knockouts you have to takeon a tag team, I guess, unless you not got a tag teamand the to priser sure, or one prizer, I guess, which doesn'thappen that often. I feel like the tag team decks, you typically canknock out two tag teams because they just have to hit the board right.So that doesn't change anything. They are and then against to prize decks thatonly use to prisers. The ATP GX attack takes a turn, so youstill have to spend three turns attacking. And then against one prize decks,I guess, is where really shines. But the only real one, prizex, seems like the altern across with deck or maybe night March, andyou can probably finess them anyway because your dark turber Dick. So right,I don't know, it'll be fine. I'm really excited about this expanded youknow, control has had its time and all right, was that that bestdeck, I think, pretty much undisputed, even in the regional that I won. If I had to go back and Redo it, having the knowledgeof the decks that were able to be played like, I think I wouldhave played, you know, as or or pidgey control. That just seemsto mild, like Pidge deck. That Sayed the best decks out of thatformat. So now that we lose chip chip, now that we lose resetStamn, now that we lose surges training method or whatever it is, surgesstrategy, UTENSI trading method, it's just it opens the format up to havinga lot of viable attacking decks. I think it's very, very cool.Yeah, yeah, I think this expanded format is going to be really interestingand I'm excited to share more with you all what we come up with.So I think that's a it's a pretty good stopping point for today. Isthere anything else you wanted to say before we hop off tow just remember tolike and follow us on the twitter account. That is I'm going to pull upthe handle here really quick, but yeah, again we're trying to makethe twitter account someplace to go to to, you know, follow what we're doingwhen we go live and all that good stuff. So follow us atat tag team Pokemon on twitter and we're going to be doing a giveaway again, like we said, Christmas Day giveaway. Look for that. You don't wantto, you know, be out of the loop for that, sofollow us now and get all that information when it comes back. Yeah,and JW are doing tag team after dark or poketure. Yeah, we're going. We're going live like as soon as we get off here, so let'slet's get to it. Cool all right. Well, thank you everyone for tunein in today and we will catch you all in the New Year.Peace.

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