Sounder SIGN UP FOR FREE
Tag Team Pokemon TCG Podcast
Tag Team Pokemon TCG Podcast

Season 1, Episode 11 · 2 years ago

10. The Pidgey Eclipse

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

What is up everybody? Welcome back to tag team. My name is Friley Hobart and I'm joined by my good, good friend JW Curry, Wall Kw. How you doing today, Riley, I'm doing fine. Once again, I'm looking forward to the holiday season. Going to get a chance to go visit family and just relax, enjoy some time together, you know, do all the things that you do on the holiday season. Love Christmas, so to be some fun coming up here. Yeah, for sure, man. I feel the same. I have the whole week off for Christmas. I say if my day is up, and I'm just gonna go back to Ohio since oftime my family and relax for the first time. Right. Well, so that's going to be off right, right, right for that. And I'm sure you're excited for some egg knock as well. I love the Eggnog. I brought in some. Well, my wife brought in some Eggnog for her Christmas party at her work and it was a huge success. And then we had another friend come over a couple days ago. She also had some of the Eggnog from the Party and said it was very, very tasty, although the only other time that she had had homemade eggnog. It had chunks because the tempering process was done cut too quickly and brambled some of the eggs. So it's actually a bigot the process. It's a very intricate process. If you want to have like a like a safer Eggnog, and what you do is you heat up the milk and then you add it, like spoonful by spoonful, into the whipped egg yolk mixture. But if you do it too fast then the eggs will cook into scrambled eggs basically inside your eggnog. So that is very interesting, actually very interesting. So yeah, you'll be my be glad to hear yesterday at work they had a eggnog French toast. Okay, I'm into it, very, very good. I'm it. Did it taste any different than regular French toast? Slightly? Yeah, it's definitely comes full difference. Okay, all right, I'm there for it. I'm there for I like French toast, I like Eggnog. I'm just an egg knock guy. So like I'll eat or drink like eggnog, milkshakes, I'll drink eggnog, you know, with any type of liqueur. I'll have egg now I mean that egg knock French toast sounds incredible. I'll just eggnog like kind of whatever way you throw it at me. Yeah, for sure. I think my like holiday seasonal thing that I really love is I love peppermint flavor. The so like, yeah, graters and Cincinnati Columbus does like peppermint chip or like peppermint stick ice cream, and that's so good. And like chickil a has the shake. That's also so good. I have a I have a free coupon for a free shake. A check will like, there you go. You gotta get the peppermint one to that. Was that rocks? Yeah, no, it is for the peppermint one. I'm looking forward to eating it. Yeah, that is or drinking it. Do you drink a milkshake or do you eat a milkshake? I guess it depends how quickly you get to get around to it relative to why you got it. Yeah, fair enough, like you start by eating it and then and then you drink it at the end. Yeah, that's how I feel usually. Yeah, like you ever have milkshakes, you just have to, you literally have to spoon them because you can't. Yeah, like all the culvers milkshakes they make them so thick. Yeah, the yeah, custards that they use. Well, anyway, take it away from food. We did have an awesome time this past a weekend at your holiday get together back in Columbus. It was really nice seeing everybody and we also got to play some pokmon. We got three play a bunch of cube, which is super cool. Now we can maybe talk about that later, but we did play some standard Pokemon at the VGMX League Cup in Columbus, Ohio. Vjmx kind of a more recent store to come up in Columbus and it's a pretty cool to see the seeing kind of blossom in Columbus. Sadly after I leave, maybe related circumstances there. But yeah, nevertheless, we both attended. And what did we end up deciding to play? JW? Well, we played piggioto control, pigioto control. So you know, I landed. It was kind of late in the evening, but we kind of mold over for a while exactly what we wanted to do. We talked quite a bit about the list and the cards that would come in and out of it. What would you say was like notable about the list that we play? What made it good? Why do we settle on something like the pigeon control of the nation that we've played? I would just say that the list was very, I don't know, straightforward, very consistent, optimized for just getting the strong turn one, specifically optimized for getting the turn one elms. So we included the full count of Elms,...

...the full count of poker gear and then one card that not a lot of people always include as a Max count of the acro bikes, which right I loved recently. Now We'd played it without Geraci, so that would be like the next like consistency card that you could either add or substitute in the place of acro bike, but in any case we went the full, like trainer route of maximized consistency to try to get that turn one attack off. Beyond that, I don't know that there was anything really unique to the our list. We took out a lot of the unusual texts that you might see, things like apps. All we didn't play. I'm trying to think of other we did go back to mew and Bruggad bonds, though, which has yeah that much. Sure, sure, that's true. So we were expecting a lot of things like Tina chomp. You Know Tina chomp. Just their spread damage turn after turn can be really devastating to your board, especially if you have kind of a slow starts. We were thinking, okay, maybe the mew from unbroken bonds could help assuage some of the difficulty with that card as it's being played in its own deck and it's also seeing some play in the Malmar decks. But yeah, it was, I thought, just a very strong call for the weekend. I ended up hitting some either bad matchups or kind of awkward things, but I thought overall we had a really good and strong sixty cards. It just didn't work out for us. Yeah, yeah, neither of US ended up making top eight, sadly. I did quite like the list that we had. Maybe we can share that unlike the tag team, twitter or something, so people can take a gander at that end decide for themselves that they like it. I would I would agree with your analysis. So it was kind of straightforward. It was designed to get the term one elms to turn two elms and then plow through the deck. We played to Hoppooz, which really helped to accelerate through the deck and I definitely noticed that as we played it to. Yep, that was a very nice boost to the digging potential. No cute cards like will or anything, but didn't really feel like they were super necessary. Lasting here, I think for the sub on twitch ten months. That's awesome, man. Think you so much for the support. Yeah, I mean I really like piggy control right now in the format. I think it's a pretty good deck and I I am always like surprised, I guess, when people say that they think control doesn't have the time to finish, because we finished all of our games and you know, obviously some of those were losses, but we finished like close games and what I felt was a comfortable amount of time. Even one game in particular, I'm thinking of, where I kind of berated you for playing slowly, you still didn't even hit time, and that game, right, there's actually several minutes after you finished it. So right, right. So, like, I just want to reiterate, as I've said several times now, that I think like stall strategies are perfectly viable and like the best of one thirty minutes. It didn't really feel like time was ever an oppressive factor or sir suing that like was causing a hindrance to me? True. Yeah, I don't know. I feel like people, if you're if you think time is a problem, you probably just haven't practice enough, because you're you're spending too much time and thinking about what you have to do right right, or you're kind of maybe making decisions that are optimized for the turn that you're on. So I found myself doing this a lot too. Is like in the mid game I would be getting back cards that I'd actually just want for like a couple prizes in the future. Like I found myself just putting back in like chip chips, which isn't necessarily a bad play, but when you're in the early and mid game, you kind of want to you know, you'd rather have, I feel, those supporters like Hapu and stuff just into the deck to make sure that you can plow through, and then you're kind of setting up to just do the Big Combo when there at you know, three or two, one prize, that kind of that kind of thing. So even I find myself kind of doing some unusual plays with the deck. I was tilted in one of the rounds where I prized tild it. Yeah, I prized to water energy, and so I had no access to articuno and it was a matchup. It was a fire blow cephalon matchup that I really would have loved to have the art the articuno access. Didn't have it and then ended up making just some weird plays. Loss was to a dark box, which was really sad because I prized a copy of the stadium that we played, the Poe Jr land, the power plant. So I couldn't chain those backto back. And I know the list that she plays plays a ton of stadiums. I think it's something like to Veridian, to night city or dark city. Maybe it's like reefridian and too dark city, something like that, just like for four, maybe five stadiums in her list which make it very difficult. And then obviously she plays the red and blue, so being able to search out the you know, search out the the energies...

...from the deck makes it really hard as well. So prizing that stadium was really tough because I could never quite get the lock and then I couldn't hold the lock. Even if I did get the lock, she was able to break out of it, which is really tough. So not going to you know, not to say like that. I couldn't have one. I guess it was just really tough with and then she had two copies of the Um, two copies of the Gus Lord. That takes two prizes every time it goes for a knockout. So I was able to mill one of them, I couldn't quite get to the next one and that one just, you know, ran me out of a rang gurus and ended up winning the game for her. So, like she played it perfectly, very very well. I just wasn't able to put enough pressure on to take the DUB. Yeah, yeah, I feel that for sure. My loss is typically it came down to one game. I had to not chip, chip for one turn and they got a reset stamp after I it was like I probably could have been angled this better, but the way that I played the cards out, which I think I probably misplayed at least, like one turn out of that game I had to Missy and Lore lie discard a ridiculous amount of cards, obviously, and then the next turn I got racists tipped to decked out and it felt so bad because, like I wasn't even thinking about that being an option until right after I'd Dis Sea and Laura led and I'm like yeah, Geez, you are. You were pretty salty. I was a little salty, I'm not gonna lie, but my opponent like saw the out and like props of them for, you know, continue to play when the odds were stacked against them too, because they had no energy left, as far as I know, like I honestly thought that they had begun to run out of energy at turn earlier than they did, because they were playing the lucariom metal and didn't grab an energy off the the metal fist. I think, like whatever grabs the energy at the deck and I'm like, Oh, you know, he's out of out of metals, like he only has these three energy left. That is like that's a fine amount, because he can't Koll my dudes. Unfortunately, he did have that last metal, which kind of like threw me for a loop. Yeah, so I think just like multiple turns of like me not not fully like comprehending what was going on. happened. They're right, and I was like for Moon. I was really upset because I could have played a pal pad and like gone up, but then I thought we were talking just now and I'm like well, wait, if I played the pal fad I would have gone down a four and then up to six. Oh, that's right, it is still once. So, like it's whatever. It was just a mess, so it's whatever. Stuff happens. It was still really fun. My other loss was just to a fire deck. I wasn't drawing super well, so I only one pigey on board most of the game and then I with the Chit turn, chip, chip, and they topped that of fire energy to knock out my Macaputerson for game. Yeah, it just it feels like a deck are our performances were kind of on the is, on that wrong side of variant where you just you know, if, like you said, if they don't draw that one card on that one turn, then like, you probably win the game handily or like. If they don't do that one thing, if they don't have that one stadium on that one turn, then you know, you probably win. Unfortunately, just didn't go like that for us. Yeah, still would consider piggy to be extremely viable deck. I don't think that there were was anything in the room that I was necessarily afraid of facing, besides maybe that dark box. I just had a ton of stadiums. But even then I think there are ways if you like played the matchup out, you know, a ton of times, like I think you still end up favorable in that matchup. I just don't think that there was necessarily anything in the room that I was saying. Man, I hope I don't play against that. Yeah, I mean I think it was a pretty good call for that tournament, just like on a conceptual level. Yeah, there wasn't a ton like even I really can't even think of anything I would be that scared of that was in the room. Like mute. She's probably one of the scarier matchups just because how fast they can like get the game moving, and there wasn't really a lot of that. Right. I'm not really scared of Malam or anything, so it felt fine. I'm pigie definitely has, I feel, like the control decks in general, or a little more suspective variance sometimes, because you're playing cards like hammers and you know you have like the flips and doll stall and like there's all sorts of weird stuff. I can just go wrong, sure, and you only have to you know, you're only playing two ups. So like you could easily prize. Yeah, it was, or or even worse, like you could never have the chance to play them because you have like, you know, a bunch of your pidgie lines or prize of the pigeon. Yeah, yeah, for sure. So actually, one of the Games I won what I prize, like three vigiotors or something ridiculous like that. But I did have like such a ridiculous bill off of Bill Elpha that look like a possible for my opponental wind, no better what. So it's like a Turd to below, though, just like I got nothing else, but it slawam and I milled like some of their most important cards to win...

...the match. Brood Dude, that's pretty funny. But yeah, it felt really good also to be back in Columbus and playing cards with some what the people I've known for a while. So I've had a great time, even if the tournamenting goes as well as I would have hoped, and honestly, I would probably take this sixty two another cup easily on a different day. Yeah, maybe with a little more time to practice and a little more sleep than night before, but I would definitely consider playing it again. I don't know if there's anything else that even really on my radar that I want to bring the cups at this point. Sure what you're feeling? Well, I would say that I'm going to be honest. You know, Malamar performed really well that weekend, I think, taking two of the Ohio Cups. Yeah, and and so you have to look at Malamar and just say, Hey, you know, we've kind of been dissing it for the longest time, but maybe it's just that Perfect Cup deck. I mean Alamar has all season been the cup monster. Yeah, yeah, absolutely, I would say, you know from memory just just that it's locked, locked down. You know at least a dozen that I can just think. I'm off my head Cup wins, which is pretty strong for for that deck. So I would say, you know, Malamar, I would definitely consider taking that to a cup like it's one, at least on a cup level, and it's kind of fun when it rolls. So definitely it's fun of what it works, I will say. Yeah, so that would be another deck on my radar. The lasting but not least, is mewtwo. I mean still going to be that strong contender for the entirety of at least this format. So definitely considering me too. If I were to go to another cup in the next few weeks, but those probably be my top three at the moment. Yeah, I wou'd say if it wasn't Piggy, I would look towards I still kind of want to try ATP even though I rag on it a lot. I just kind of want to try it, have it in my hands at a cup. It just seems like kind of fun, even if you get your strategy actually going, it seems pretty fun. And I would also probably playing Alamar as like a third choice as well. We both were talking about this after the Cup and actually even before the Cup we were kind of talking like hey, you know, I'm Alamar might be an option, and we're like no, no, no, let's just not resign ourselves of playing Alamar and then Lamar and at up winning the Cup that we were at. Yeah, and so we're kind of like yeah, up winning and it I don't think it really had that much representation. It was like two people. I was going to say there weren't that many people. I think it only had one placement, a top eight. So just just going to show that, you know, it's really not on a lot of people's radar or at least in my local metagame. Yeah, so it's kind of surprised me because, like, Columbus has historically been like a very Malamar Centurya. HMM. Yeah, so, you know, that's that's how the cookie crumbles. I malmars like a deck I am less inclined to play just because of makes it kind of anxious and also, just like sleeve in those suckers up just feels kind of bad and of itself. Like you, just like you have, you have such like a negative reaction to it from the past that it may be hard for us at this point, like are the Milin of our brain has us that Malamar's bad and like we can't play it. So we get repulse anytime we see Malamar. I mean, don't get me wrong. To you, like I've stand malmore more so than you have. I think like I was right. I was Super Intovoutmar from world, which was I think would have been a bad choice. But now now to go beyond this format. Obviously we're getting a new set in a couple months. Do you think Malamar gets better with, you know, with the new set at all? This is like kind of tangentially related, but do you think that Malamar continues to be, you know, this cut, this very like decent, maybe very strong, local Cup deck, or does it get way better to the point that we may start seeing it perform it you know well, on the regional level. I think there's like pluses and mines that are going to come with Malmar. Like the Quick Ball, I think it is, and evolutionary incense are both really good. I think those are the cards that malmars looking at from sword and shield, so obvious assets. They're just being able to set up better is all that Malmar really wants. And your quick ball is kind of like another set of treasures that you can throw in your deck. Almost I can't grab them Olmar, but it can grab your in Gaze, which almost are more important to grab. So I do like that, but I don't think it really gains a lot in the in the way of like attackers or like options. It just feel like do the Strategi already just better. And...

...the reason that concerns me is that it also gets like the Sycamore supporter, which is super good for Malmar, and thank you to Keel for the for the bits. The thing that concerns me, though, is that there's now these really viable, insanely high hp Pokemon, where Maltmore is now like three hitk owing them pretty naturally, even like with spell tags and stuff, you know, with those v Max has, and so that's that seems rough to me, especially if they utilize like mountain Lana and stuff. I'm thinking stuff like the like the Lappers v Max. I could see that being played for sure, with the frost moth. Yeah, Snore Lax v Max could also see play. It's just like it's hard to tell. I and I hate to like theorym on that far ahead to because the game is like fundamentally change and going into sword and shield right, right, exactly, and that's I mean, it's interesting, right, because we've said for the long time like that is why Malamar maybe isn't best suited for this format, because you just have these huge tag teams that can heal with Malowe Lana. But that hasn't really deterred and actually we've seen the Malamar list evolved and adapt. I think the most notable inclusion in Malamar it has been just a big tag team of its own, be it Lunala and so goalleo or, I think more popularly, the Guiarantina guard chop tag team and just both those being able to deal that big damage to kind of get over the Hump, be able to take, you know, what would have been maybe a two or three shot by a Malmar into one shot. Yeah, yeah, I mean those are all definitely factors. It's I think Malamar's a really hard deck to call, but it's almost feel also feels like an impossible deck to ever write out, if that makes sense. Like, I don't want to attest to Malmar being one of the best decks in the format, but I wouldn't I would not say it's like unviable or anything like that either, because prol Mars is one of those decks that always clause its way from whatever pit it's trapped in into being a good, viable deck sure, or at least good enough, you know, for the haters out there. Absolutely cool. Well, let's move on from Malamar discussions into something new. I don't know what we talk about now. Well, I mean I gotta say the cosmic clips format kind of burned self pretty quick, not because it was inherently a bad format, although I wasn't a huge fan of it, but just because, like a lot happened with it in a very short time. So like we plowed through events. Now there's like nothing left in Godsmke clubs standard, but I do think there's a ton of he had and shout out to the tricky gimmers that raid there. The expanded format, I think, has a lot to be explored still, and I mean now we're in a post band world. You and I've been talking quite a bit about like what we want to bring to Dallas coming up. That's going to be a huge tournament. I'm really excited for that. Yeah, so what does the future hold in that regard? Like we could look towards Sword Shield all we want, but I don't think we can really predict yet. But expanded is just around the corner and I know, I hope you love expanded jw because it's good, it's gracious. You're the most recent expanded rigional channel, or well, second most recent, second most recent. Yes, yes, yes, don't don't forget. I can never forget Ian Rob because he just SK and robs specially our deck. Yeah, but yeah, no, second time and rob is destroyed my death right. Yeah, exactly, exactly. Yeah, shout outs to Natalie Um but yeah, I think there are six vible deck that I'm really looking at breaking down in the expanded format. I don't know that they're going to turn out to be, you know, the six tier one decks, although I do believe a lot of them are very strong. I just think these are kind of the six decks that I initially go to as being the best deck of the expanded format and I think they will probably be some of the most played in Dallas. And so I've been saying this for a while, but I think Guardian, mew three, Altnacrosma Zoro, garb, dark box and the Humpty dumpty vileplume deck. I think those are the six decks that I'm looking to initially and saying they have a lot of strengths. They do a lot of things really, really well. They maybe were archetypes in the past that continue to be viable and maybe even get better with the loss of the stall decks. Yeah, and they, you know, for a lot of these they gained something, you know, very cool from the most recent set. So for those reasons, I think these six decks are the kind of the ones that I'm going on to the ladder and testing with friends and telling people that I think most of them are going to be good plays. It's just kind of figuring out the best play. Yeah, and the best list as well. I know you and I both are very much fans of for finding down lists, to the nitty gritty pieces of it, but probably why we work...

...so well together when it comes to decks. Sure. So let's go one by one then. I think the first one that comes to mind for me, and one that we talked quite a bit about this past weekend, would be this oral garb archetype. You know, just came off a win in Portland with Ian Rob and overall, I think continues to just be a strong deck and every single expanding format that we've seen in the post, like red card, hex world. Talk to me a little about your thoughts on the Zoor Guard, but you told me and before the screen that you're not super into it. It feels kind of mediocre. I have some thoughts that I'd love to to speak to you on that, but I want to I want to hear your side first. Pills or garb is definitely a deck that I feel I could be, you know, on one side of the bed one day and the other side the other day where it could flip flop between being this kind of average deck that I don't see a lot of potential in to being, you know, the Tier One archetype that can take any single deck down. And unfortunately recently I've just been on the wrong side of that and saying, you know, did some testing on on twitch and on my channel and just kind of seeing the deck perform in action. I was losing a lot to things that play garbodor. I was losing, you know, to alter acrosma stuff that would just be able to use an ATP and I couldn't dig for my ranger fast enough and then they'd be able to one shot Zor arcs and then I'd be in this really awkward position. Not Good Right, because they'd have the garbodor up and it was just like wow, I should conceptually be able to destroy this deck, like I have ranger in my deck. I should be able to, you know, do some tricky things, you know, maybe Faba their energy or kill their garbodor and like end them low and maybe they're out of energy or things like that. But it was never that easy and I kind of got down on myself on the dead deck. I think again, it's always going to be inherently decent. I'm just not sure what the format shaving up if it has what it takes to be the winning deck, like the best deck in the format. Yeah, I think that's a pretty good summary what I kind of alluded to. We've talked about this a lot in person now is is or Garve always feels not mediocre, but it's like you have to try harder to win. It feels like then a lot of decks. It's not necessarily a bad thing all the time. No, it's just like it doesn't feel it as good. In my opinion, it's some other never never controls the game from start to finish. I've I've found like there's usually like a turn, and especially now with these decks, like there's usually a turn where it's like if I don't hit it here, like if I don't hit it off this end, then I'm in a really bad spot. It just never can control the pace of the game the way like a turbo dark can, where they can pop off from turn one and you basically just know you're going to win the game. It's just kind of going through the motions, just attack right or going to thing like vio plum. Right you get up the Item Lock Vio Plume and your opponent doesn't have a board presence and then you know, okay, I'm I'm going to have the time I need to build up an attacker and just win. It doesn't have that strength from beginning to end, although what it loses in the early game I think it does make up for in the lake game. You do have a lot of options to lock your opponent in the lake game we think of the GARBOTOX and garbodor. Think I'm just end being a very strong card. You're more able to draw out of a lake game end. So it does have some things that go for it in the lake game, but it's just kind of getting to that lake game that's always the issue. Yeah, as or garb always feels like kind of a an exploration into like routing your game plan and prize mapping and, you know, getting to end game board states, whereas you know, you play stuff like turbo dark and you're hey, well, you know, it's turn one. Let's figure out what we can do use our garbs. Turn one, like most impressive turn one you can have. Is like bench a couple basic poker I like maybe shaming at the end of it, like right. So, yeah, it's just an even like I don't know. I'd Dec I like Guardian. I think Guardian is another good play that also feels has this like feeling of inevitability. Yeah, you know, where if you can get that magical miracle for six probably you know going to win like eighty percent of the games, right that that happens or something like that. It just it has this kind of inevitable feeling where if you can just get to that win condition, then you know you're then you're going to win. And whereas garbodors or arc is like, you know, what can you think is like the ideal board, you know, having like fors ORC out and maybe the garbotoxin down. But even then it gets kind of weird because like shut off your own abilities, and I don't it is there's a lot of things like going on. For sure, there's a lot of things that are going on in a lot of things that are connterintuitively. Yeah, yeah, for sure. I mean I think...

...probably my favorite deck right now is still turbo dark. It's just, you know, I love the UNGABUNGA strategy of just going ham with the elixirs in the patches term one and saying you know what you got, man, yeah, answer me, like you figure this out. What can you do in response to that? I think that's just like a strategy that'll always see some modicum of success because it's just so straightforward and so powerful and it's asking such like important questions of your opponent, you know, like being able to one shot a tag team on turn to. It can't ever be that bad, right, like it can't be terrible. So if any of you have any additional thoughts on on turbo dark or why it might be a good or bad play, well again, I mean turbo dark was really good last format, so I think it just maintains its strength. It kind of beat everything. I don't see too much, too many new decks coming out of US cosmic eclipse aside from, you know, aside from the alternate acrossma deck. I mean there are new decks that will come out of cosmic eclipse, but in my initial kind of testing, in my initial views on you know, tcg Oh and just my experiences, I don't really see a lot of the new cards making brand new archetypes outside of alternate acrosma, but even then I think dark box can handle that deck, you know, for the most part. Again, I need to do some specific testing of that match up, but there's nothing really that I'm scared of. If I look through the list of like possible options, there wasn't really that much that turbot arc was scared of last format and I don't believe that there's anything new that it should be scared of. Yeah, so let's actually shift focus then. You've talked about they're not being a ton of new decks besides ulternate ACROSSMA. I mean, I think we've talked a lot about these existing decks and I don't think they transform and a significant enough way to really two for there to be much new information there. But the new deck, I think that is truly interesting. The people is this altern acrosma deck with the baby oltn ACROSMA has that ability which prevents it from attacking unless your opponent as at too or less prizes. But you know, they are all sources of ways and expanded to turn offf abilities, including but not limited to garbodor muck and silent lab, all sorts of very effective ways to be able to tack the Oulternate Cross were doing one hundred and seventy four two and discarding of energy off your opponent, like just Cuz I guess right, that's pretty good. That's pretty good, they ought to say. And you compare that easily with ATP. You can just leave it solo. There's all sorts of ways we're seeing that be played. Yeah, my personal problem with that strategy. I think it's pretty good. There are actually two things I don't like about it. The first thing that bothers me is that pokemon ranger as a card, as a card that people like love to throw in their deck randomly. It appears in all sorts of like aggressive turbo we kind of decks and or like so arc decks. Just throw it in just because they can turn out trade away if you don't want it. So makes me a little anxious because you're playing like an ATP focus build and they pokemon ranger. You then you wasted an ATP and an attachment and an attack and now you're like, well, I guess I probably lose now. Huh? So, yes, yeah, well, I would just counter that to say that the alternate ACROSMA can put so much pressure on that a ranger in a lot of cases doesn't right matter. So it's like it depends on the situation, obviously you know, and it depends on like your board state and how often they're able to goose my but there's another thing that I don't like us well, which is the fact that there's a lot of pieces to chain if your opponent is putting pressure on you. So, like you know, I think the deck is very vulnerable situations where you get your pokemon knocked out, you get end to a lowhand size and now you have to find usually, I think the ULTRAMATECROSMA DEC really likes to gust. So you have to find a gust card, and I know they're playing like great catchers and stuff to help with that, but still you have to find a gust card, a pokemon hopefully have on the bench and another energy attachment of which you only played for so that's a kind of a tall ask. You know, it's not necessarily easy to find all that immediately, especially if you get ends to one or two and you like, well, I have to find this like three very specific cards. And Yeah, totally. I mean I think that lists will start to modify themselves to, you know, be able to counter that I mean I'm thinking of things like teammates going in the deck that...

I haven't really seen many I mean teammates is an obvious inclusion, right, for the Special Energy One prize decks. Right, right, I think so. But I just just saying, like the decks will adapt the things that I'm seeing now, and even the initial concept that I had of the list was maybe a little bit more focused on Goosemanhala, whereas I think, you know, playing it more, I see that the build that I initially had is very clearly not the eerier build, and so I do find that the garbodor yeah limits you in that way of, you know, getting end you're a little more susceptible to a la game and whereas a mock artillery Combo can give you that additional draw power that you need at the end of the game. So it'll be very interesting to see how that deck and changes over time, because I do think it is the deck that a lot of people say, Oh yeah, you know, you put ultrain acrossman garbodor together like it makes the perfect pair. And and yes, they're very good together. However, there are other ways to build it and I don't believe and the initial stage of testing that the Garbo or variant is far and away the best variants of play. Right. I mean there's tradeoffs, right. So, like the mock is the most consistent way to turn off your ability and you can have access to other things. Same thing with silent lab. They have evolved abilities. But then the trade side is your opponent, namely your Zark. Opponent, will have access to their evolved abilities and know also stuff like Guardian will have access their involved abilities on the Romantis. But mock artillery is definitely something I would personally be a fan of because of stuff like an you know you cannot. You can't so easily take advantage of ending your opponent. But either way I think there's some kind of build to make it work better than I think it has so far. Leaning hard into Sycamore and teammates might be the way to go and just having catchers and never using goosemo or Liz Sander. But even then there's like there's still a lot that can go wrong when you have a basic deck like basic, non gx, special energy focused deck like that and it doesn't necessarily have one shot. Says one shots on Shaman's and den a's and that's like and La, which basically a loss and less play by the day, it feels like. But then it doesn't want shot like gx is or stuff like night march. You're kind of similar in some ways. Like you have you're doing a lot of damage. If you're using the special energy attachment. You're a one prize attacker, but you're one hit kowing things no matter what's in the active so it's like I think they have an interesting like balance there between what's the good good and what's the better one prize play. Actually think night March might have a significant or like be a force to be reckoned with and it's new metagame, because they don't think a lot of people are really thinking about it and being able to one shot things. Yeah, it's always nice, right. I think problem, though, I feel like the comfort pick will be's or garbodor for a lot of players, and then I think that, you know, the obvious inclusion ins or garbodor is just a one of our Choreo. Sure. So I'm not too sure how big night march will be in this format, but you do have a point that you know it's not being talked about. It always seems to resurface and due the best when it's kind of under the radar. So we'll see if, if night march does in fact show up in spades. Well, another thing to consider is, like, you know, stuff like night march. It thrivees obviously when people aren't prepared for it. And right, you know, stuff like Zoro garb is pretty tight, unlike the cars that you can include, like if you have a you do a lot with the deck, but you know, you can only fit so many text and if they have to choose between like teching for ultern acrosma, attacking for a night march going to this event, which would you think the person, I mean more likely to choose? I think would be alternate ACROSSMA. I would agree. Yes, so I don't know. It's like it's kind of interesting how all that like adds up to how it deck might do well or or not. Any is anything else that like jumps out to you specifically from cosmic a? Yeah, yeah, there is just one second jolly Flim that you know, night March has a bad alternate across match up. Yeah, I mean I would say so. Right, if they use the ATP then they can still outpace you, because you know if they use ATP on the first turn and then even if you're able to knock out the ATP, which I'm not even sure how you would, let wars what's that? Electriferis? Oh, yeah, with electric powers. Even if you knock at the ATP, then they could still go knock on, knock on, knockout consecutively and win that prize trade. So yes, unless they have the ranger in their night march, they will likely lose to the alternate acrossma that plays ATP, although if they if the ranger, knock at ATP in the same turn, you'd instantly lose. Yes, would be very funny. That would be insane. Yes,...

...that would be very funny and crazy. I would love to see that and I'm sure there will be a game like that on stream in Dallas. But the other thing that kind of jumps out to me is that I do think mew three will be a good deck for the tournament. It gains a lot with the with the decline of the Zoric control deckx. I think that's just a deck and that might also again be meet saying I want this deck to be good, but I do really believe that mew two was in a good spot last format, but it just got hated out by things like you know, or control specifically. Just was too much to overcome. And so mew three seems to be a deck that I would be comfortable telling people to play, something I'd be comfortable playing and something that I think just is a now a more viable deck than it was last format. And then I think plume retains its power. I think it stays this strong deck. I don't think a lot of people will be thinking about it heading into the regional you know, with with alternate across on being, I think, the new hype, I think a lot of people kind of sleep a little bit on plume. I'm about this. There might be people that are taking for plume. I've seen a lot of WAYBA FETT and I've include WHYBA FETT in my list to try to help out with the item lock, something that we didn't see last format. But I do think vioplume will maintain its place as as a good choice. Yeah, I mean if our plume really struggled as well against those control decks which are fading out. I don't think it has the best stor or guard matchup, but certainly more winnable in some of these control matchups. That's for that's for Dank. Sure. I also really do like changing up kind of the way we've seen you too, with stuff like a lot penny now existing. You can play cards like Gooseman Halla and even just like a couple DC's Ryan being able to really there's the problem I had primarily with you two is that it had a lot of trouble dealing with stuff like darker Ey that gets set up too fast. Is One shots you round, but if you just throw a megalotle Puney in this card, you grab a DC in a D valley, you're probably going to one shot the dark rights in the active. Yeah, yeah, the cool thing through is that you can do things like, if you play a more dce focused build, you can play things like seisman toad, which you know is basically like Noi burn, and then to also make it, you know, make an easier snipe attack, you have access to snipy and Minosaur Gx, which cool card that you know, for one energy attachment you can do fifty two other whole bench. So ideally, you know, the Zoro Guard player could lose their entire bench in one turn when I would be unfortunately, very, very strong. I'd be unfortunate for them, for sure. Yeah, I think there's a lot of clever new tricks that can come out of having DC as an option. Now, and especially you don't even have to run for if you don't want to, if you have Guzman Holland out of like consistently grab that out of the deck whenever you want it. Right. Absolutely, I'm personally excited to see. I'm you, two evolves, for that was a deck that was really fun and really interesting strategically to play. So I'm sure there's all sorts of cool things that people will try, and I'm sure that will try quite a few of them as well, because we will stay im Youtwo in this jet. We we do, and both formats for his kind of we're kind of shills for me too. Yeah, that's right. Cool. Well, I think that's a pretty good primer on where we are expanded right now. I think that was the only other topic we really wanted to directly address today, so we will open up the floor two questions here before we do that. Jw Know, I did want to prior preemptively announce that we do have this tag team twitter account, this tag team Pokemon, I believe it is on twitter, and on Christmas Day we are not going to be doing a podcast, but instead we will be doing a giveaway. So we launching a giveaway on our twitter. What you'll need to do? We are still figuring out the card. We believe that we have the card, but we're going to be giving away some very rare expensive card as long as you were tweet and follow our twitter. Just going to be something fun to kind of drive some engagement and just get the community involved just give away something on Christmas. So we think that will be a really fun way to to do that. Yeah, so giving it away. All you have to do is like retweet and follow the account and then you'll enter to win one of these really cool full art what do we say, Riley? What do we say? Well, we don't want to lock it in and sentence stone yet, but we know we're looking at we're looking at a couple cards and I think I think the fans like it. So so be on the look out for that. Do Follow the account. That's the best way to keep in a loop as far as what's going on and things going to be doing and I think in the future will use that as a if we get more followers, that as...

...sort of a question submission mechanism, so we can tweet a couple days ahead of time and you all can pose those questions that you want answered during the week's cast. So yeah, I think overall it serves to benefit everyone here if we drive engagement there, because I think it will allow us to create the content that best suits your needs. Yeah, absolutely, and it's always great to have people submit con submit questions in the chat, but sometimes there are topics that we didn't even consider that would have been really good to actually dive a little bit deeper into during the podcast. So yeah, just having that outlet to be able to say those a little bit earlier is always great. We have one question from Nikil. Earlier in the stream he says, are you guys excited for the V cards and vmax cards, or are you sick and tired of three prizers? Yeah, I can start on that. I don't really have a problem with three frisers as much as some people that spokenly do, as I think what will really determine how good of a format is is if is like the variety of strategies. That's all that really matters to me, whether that's one Priz or three prisor for Friser, and I think tag team actually did have a good variety of strategies that were cool and interesting and viable. Whether or not the vmax format will maintain that seems to remain to be seen, but I like how you evolve the v Max has. That's a little more interesting than tag teams just being slammed on the board. It's sure. The only thing I really don't like is how the Regular v's are basically just x is again. Yeah, because I thought X is were much more underwhelming mechanic than gx has. Right, right, absolutely, you know, at least, especially to go back to that, you know. So are you excited for vs JW? I mean I think the V cards are cool. I think the three prize deck, three prize attackers lend themselves very well the competitive play in that you know, you only have thirty minutes in a cup or in a challenge to player matches. So I just think that being able to finish a match a little bit on the quicker side. Never I mean, you know, the longer the game goes, the more room there is to make misplays or two out player opponent. But I do believe that with the three prizers it will and it has, I feel, like, accelerated the strength and the growth of the game just in general from like an entry level standpoint to the point that I think they're good for the game, even if they make the games easier. We've seen that they haven't completely like destroyed the stall mechanics. Stall still very good. Those, I think those types of stratgy she will always be good and be things that people can play. But I personally like the three prizes. I think they're very good from a competitive play standpoint. Hey Man, team, yell, let's go. That'd be fun. Yeah, I mean we're I don't know, it's kind of a we're in an era of still expansion from an HP standpoint. Somebody brings up I was hoping we'd get to three hundred fifty HP stage two's and like we're not done yet, right, like it's not over yet. Let's keep going. Have to be. They have to be like the highest HP pokemon like ever, right, because you can't. I could never see them going like the vmax plus or something and it's just like double the size of emacs that just now we're getting ridiculous. What if things like you combine two cards together, gives like six prizes and has six hundred health? There's something that would be crazy. I like, I don't know, maybe that mechanic could be good if, like it said, you can't bench anymore pokemon or like you can't have a bench. You know. So you're just against this one, dude, but it just still sounds so wrong that. Does somebody mess up? That would be kind of cool, though, if there's just like some pokemon card that was insanely powerful, but you can't have a bench while you have it and like maybe maybe even like part of the abilities, just like you pluck it out of your deck when you start and like throw out in the activity. Don't Mulg in a million times. Yeah, that sounds like it be kind of whatever. That's I'll ask you here. I ask, considering how quickly people lose interest in formats, could the world outside Japan support the Japan release schedule of a set or mini st every month? Thoughts? I think that's fine, I although I would contest like the beginning of that saying, considering how quickly people lose interest in formats. I don't know if that's necessarily the case for for me, he I think there have been formats that I've had a sustained interest in four months at...

...a time. But yes, I do feel like I'm in a lull right now. So I'm going to be biased and say like, of course I would want more mini sets to kind of spice things up, but I don't think it's quite so bad is as maybe the question is painted it to be, although I will agree. I mean I always love an influx of new cards, always love an influx of new strategies, so I'd support it. Yeah, I don't. It's like kind of weird because we get such massive sets right now that it gives us a lot to work with and I think that theoretically, that formats could last a while and there's still more to be discovered. I think part of it is how the tier two events and up are or organized. So if they're all on one end of the format, that's typically when the most development in the format will happen, just because that's when the most hot players are working on their decks and showing them on the largest stage, serving us to see them. I don't really think that a bunch of mini sets really solves anything, because it just all that really does is dilute the quality of each individual set, right like instead of getting you two and macart or and spond the axis and all that stuff and one say, it would be split out over like two or three sets and would just make each individual set kind of underwhelming and feel kind of weird, at least with how we currently structured it. So at I don't really think it would solve anything to have like more compower departmentalized breakdowns. If anything, it would just make it harder to be a consumer and player. He's you have to keep up with so much all the time. Yeah, that's the other part right. That is just more cards means more expense to the player. I mean they could maybe, like, maybe, like you alluded to, not make the set so big to begin with and then release like a mini set later. But you know, we'll see. We'll see what happens. I would support it, but there are definitely pros and constable. So we'll take two more questions. There's one I would like to hit on, or not really question, but a comment. PK Bubble says that POKEMON V seem balance right now, but I'm afraid it will turn into tag teams or of started balance then took over the format. I don't know when. To you that peak ram seemed balanced, but I think tag teams started off pretty broken. Yeah, I mean I think there was like I think when they say balance, they're were really referring to like there were evolution decks, one prize evolution dex. I think specifically of a deck like wheezing, which that sucks it well, yeah, but you know, it's still existed in the same format and you know I've had that's not the fault of the Polke tag teams either. It's the fault of like we didn't have any way to search out one frisers or any weakness checks. Like it's not like the tag teams were designed and such an incredibly broken way relative to the original ones. It's like sure, we just have no checks to them. And Right now, sure, yeah, I mean it's interesting. Right. And for the last question of the night. Three VOTV ASS. Do you feel dark dragons or turbo dark is better suited for the current Meta and expanded and have you guys done any testing comparing the two? I have only tested turbo dark. I feel like it is extremely strong. Dark dragons feels good from a conceptual standpoint. I just am curious as to whether or not it is as streamlined. Obviously it's not going to you know, you're trying to fit in more things, so it's not going to be as consistent. So that would be the biggest thing that would worry me about dark dragons. Obviously that has like a more strong potential, but you're risking the already like and turbo dark is already strong. So you're kind of taking away some of the just inherent strength of the consistency of turbo dark and putting it into other things that make it maybe a bit stronger but less consistent. So I would say stick with turbo dark. If you're finding that that deck is struggling in the things that you're playing against are the things of your friends are playing against her in your local Meta, then maybe start to look into dark dragons. But I don't really think that dark dragons adds anything that turbot dark can't handle by itself. Yeah, I am inclined to agree. And also dark dragons makes me a little anxious because all the things that really make dragons special and good. I'm thinking of Guarantina and ATP, are both get bodied by ranger, which people are already looking at putting in their decks. And so at that point, why not just play a more consistent version that I'll hate your Max lilixers every time, which I love doing that. Yeah, the counter to that, is it right? Is like you use your ATP, use the GX attack, and then you're immediately set up. If they don't want shy you, you're immediately set up to just start accelerating energies and then at the point that you can accelerate energies, you're you know, you're going to go buck wild with how much stuff...

...you have on the field. So that would be kind of the car counter arguments way yours, and I mean I see that and I does that to you. As well. As at the ATP can accelerate the darks, which is like so cool, but you know you're hitting maxlixers less. You have to find these dark you're just double dragon energies, which isn't that big of a challenge, but still, whereas you could, instead of gx attacking with ATP turn one, you just knock something out and so instead of winning the game in two attacks after an ATPGX, you can win it in either two attacks or three attacks excluding the ATPGX. So right. So what's the point? I guess. Right exactly, you know, like ATP doesn't change the amount of knockouts you have to take on a tag team, I guess, unless you not got a tag team and the to priser sure, or one prizer, I guess, which doesn't happen that often. I feel like the tag team decks, you typically can knock out two tag teams because they just have to hit the board right. So that doesn't change anything. They are and then against to prize decks that only use to prisers. The ATP GX attack takes a turn, so you still have to spend three turns attacking. And then against one prize decks, I guess, is where really shines. But the only real one, prize x, seems like the altern across with deck or maybe night March, and you can probably finess them anyway because your dark turber Dick. So right, I don't know, it'll be fine. I'm really excited about this expanded you know, control has had its time and all right, was that that best deck, I think, pretty much undisputed, even in the regional that I won. If I had to go back and Redo it, having the knowledge of the decks that were able to be played like, I think I would have played, you know, as or or pidgey control. That just seems to mild, like Pidge deck. That Sayed the best decks out of that format. So now that we lose chip chip, now that we lose reset Stamn, now that we lose surges training method or whatever it is, surges strategy, UTENSI trading method, it's just it opens the format up to having a lot of viable attacking decks. I think it's very, very cool. Yeah, yeah, I think this expanded format is going to be really interesting and I'm excited to share more with you all what we come up with. So I think that's a it's a pretty good stopping point for today. Is there anything else you wanted to say before we hop off tow just remember to like and follow us on the twitter account. That is I'm going to pull up the handle here really quick, but yeah, again we're trying to make the twitter account someplace to go to to, you know, follow what we're doing when we go live and all that good stuff. So follow us at at tag team Pokemon on twitter and we're going to be doing a giveaway again, like we said, Christmas Day giveaway. Look for that. You don't want to, you know, be out of the loop for that, so follow us now and get all that information when it comes back. Yeah, and JW are doing tag team after dark or poketure. Yeah, we're going. We're going live like as soon as we get off here, so let's let's get to it. Cool all right. Well, thank you everyone for tune in in today and we will catch you all in the New Year. Peace.

In-Stream Audio Search

NEW

Search across all episodes within this podcast

Episodes (138)