Sounder SIGN UP FOR FREE
Tag Team Pokemon TCG Podcast
Tag Team Pokemon TCG Podcast

Season 2, Episode 19 · 2 years ago

2-19. Kevin Krueger Breaks Limits

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

The boys are joined by recent Limitless Invitational Champion- Kevin Krueger! Listen in to his detailed perspective on his tournament runs, his deck choice, and his vision fr how to improve as a player.

What is up everybody? Welcome back to tag team, the POKEMON Trading Card Games from mere podcasting duo, today with a special guest. My name is Riley Holbert and I'm joined today by my friend JW Crew Wall. JW, how you do today? I'm doing pretty well. Riley, how are you? I'm doing pretty so well. And Jade, why don't you introduce our very special guest, the winner of the limitless invitational we have with us today, Kevin Krueger. Say Hey, welcome to the cast. Thanks for having me. Yeah, we're really excited to have you and talk to you as a player who went through, you know, all the qualifier, all the qualifiers, and then made it to the final big tournament and ended up winning that. That's just a very special thing, like a month's work of work, you know, for weekends right, and then the culmination weekend last week. So very, very cool. How do you feel? Just kind of you've probably going to ask this question and, given your odds, too many people, but how does it feel to win this style of event? So it's certain to set in. I've kind of been on Claude nine for a couple days. What after I won, it just just kind of surreal that I started to set in, like I love my deck. I got pretty good matchups throughout the tournament. I was thinking back to to just, you know, even the qualifiers. I was pleasantly surprised that I qualified. Had some really good luck the first top eight run and then I think I made some good deck choices the next couple the sort of get into second day again, but as pretty just surprising that it did so consistently well. I've always thought of myself as a good player. I've got several DT'S IRL but I haven't really had that big finish before. Won a couple week ups in February march, but this is kind of on another level. Yeah, I know it's really quite impressive just because you have all these different qualifiers, like you're saying, like only what twelve people made it in from, you know the normies, and then we had a lot of content creators making in as well, and that was really what was most exciting to me to see someone that grinded through all those tournaments when the final invitational, that was really cool. So talk to us a little bit, just very briefly, kind of the tournaments that you played in leading up to the invitational you played in the first one. It was a firebox list. Is that right, because I remember we played against each other. Yeah, we faced each other day one. I think it was round ten or something, and I was yeah, no, and I think you were my first loss, if I remember right. Yeah, but I was like ten in two against Atpz that tournament. Like it was kind of a nutty run. I was drawn pretty hot. But yeah, that was a great tournament. Firebox is something people didn't expect. For that one I had been changing decks that whole format. Was not able to set one things, I don't like playing your matches, so I usually stay away from what people perceive as the best deck. So I was trying to find something that could beat a Tepez, you know, had a chance against other stuff. And then the other thing is I really just hate losing to mill. So I chose the deck that mill was not prepared for. Specifically. Actually got some of my bad luck that tournament against Mel and lost a couple rounds. You a bad prizing and I faced the one guy that played wab effect with stealthy hood. But buy and large, the mill matchups pretty free for sure. Yeah, and so that was ended up being actually a really good medical. If you play really aggressively and hit your walders, it's worked out to like forty or so. Against Adpez, it's long as you take a prize before they altered creation, then you end up winning round. So that was, you know, too big, big positives that the day to is just littered with those. I actually had to beat some other random decks this weekend, a top eight, peak, a ram and ultimate Mewtwo, which my deck is unfavored against, but I just hit the right stuff and was able to stay one step ahead. My deck was built really aggressively. I didn't have any hand disruption. Basically the game plan was get your Walders, play poke gears, lots of Gage's, take the first couple prizes and then just sort of carry your lead through. Yeah, I'm really pretty simple, but it was a consistent list and I had some good variants and ended up being a really good medicalll my top eight game I played pretty well. I think my opponent was playing at Pez. He won the coin flip and he played exceptionally well. He set it up so that I was not able to take any prizes on turn one. You always left his ATP active, which is correct. guilize, you take a cheap prize on Geraci and then you do a three hundred damage on the ATP at some point. And Gust reposition or did Ann a win in three knockouts, but you would always walll me off for the first turn when he went first. I can't Gust on my first turn. Sure, there's just nothing I could do. He played really well. He drew well. Yeah, really good player with...

...the coolest he was playing heavy goose Mahala. It was able to search out all his defensive tools, like he had game three, big charm ATP and Metal Frying panization on the bench with like three energies on board, and I with welder turn one going second. Yeah, this is gonna be hard. Nothing, just brand me over. So I didn't have any regrets about, you know, going out that way. I'm really happy with how I played that tournament. And then that got me all excited, like wow, it's copy finished to start. I actually qualify for this. Yeah, it's got to kind of keep it up from here. Yeah, and so you're coming off a top eight finish in that qualifier one, and was that kind of the difference that you were thinking, well, maybe I wouldn't play in the other qualifiers if I didn't do well in the first one, or re planning on playing and all for to start with, anyway, I probably would have kept playing. I think if I whipped on like the first two, then I might have dropped off some of them, especially because three and four I was working night shifts, so I had to work all night home, then play all day and then go back to work again at night. So those ones I think I probably would have ended up sitting out just for scheduling purposes. But at that point I was I was committed and I was in third place after the first team, and you had a lot of people rooting for you, I'm sure. Yeah, that's awesome. All right. So the first qualifiers done, you're feeling pretty good. You know, not not too many people did better than you and that first one, and then you move on to the second qualifier. You still made the second day of competition playing a similar list, and kind of talk us through maybe that tournament and what you decided to change between between one and two. So yeah, I just I changed a couple cards. I thought the deck was still good in terms of Meta. The thing that I thought would pick up and play, which did a little bit, was mill, since it did really well in the first one, and so I put a cramer ant in there so I could snipe skelty hooded Waba fette if it came down to it. Sure, but I made the wrong cut, is the problem. I cut the Kini V, which is your best attacker against me too, Malamar, which ended up being like totally the play for qualifier too, and I think I over the two days, I played it like five times and I think I lost, for it was just really bad and without the the team Nev can manually attached to twice and then still like two shot at mew two and mugs and then spreading flames is good against it to I just I really missed that card in that matchup and I regret that switch that I made. I played really well. I kept smashing ATPEZ. I eat a couple mills. I had a couple misplays against the Malamar mewtwo deck as well, which is frustrating. That text rap start play against. Yeah, they can punish you in so many ways. So I wasn't thrilled with my gameplay. That was the one I sort of squeaked into day two. I just barely got to nine and four, basically by beating everything else. I think three of my four losses were to Malamar decks and at that point I'm like I really made the wrong cut here, but let's just play it out. Day Two. I hit three more Malamars and think I lost to him. I want my other rounds, but ended up like a twelve and eight, so that was a lower finish. I think top one hundred and twenty eight. That was a little smaller numbers. So it was still top one hundred and twenty eight points, which was pretty decent. But yeah, I think if I had left the Victini the in, I probably would have had another winner, to sure, but I didn't have the super hot draws that I had in the first qualifier to get all the way to up a right, right, and that happens, of course, right, and it's hard of that when your hand is like two cars. He Yeah, good. So then we come up on qualifiers three and four. Obviously in a new format, we got new cards, new set released. And how did rebel clash kind of impact what you wanted to do? I mean I see here from from limless, who played the Dragon Pul list and yet another day too, and in the third qualifier, and kind of walk us through numbers three and four and what you were thinking with the addition of rebel clash. So historically I usually take a couple months to really like find my groove after a new set drops, because the medic gets all thrown into disarray. I never know what to play at first and then I sort of switch decks every couple of weeks until I find something that really, really like, and then I'll get really good at that one deck and then I usually circuting results. Abilities are or fire box was kind of a comfort big for me. So that was an easy transition for the first couple you set dropping. I had to test, you know, all the...

...new stuff. Mainly I tested dragon bolts and it seemed really good. Fire box was terrible because you couldn't hit the numbers anymore. So I'd like, okay, we're dropping that. Dragon Fault smashes mills. So mills probably dead, but this deck just seems good. I went with kind of a personal build that was little wacky. I had for super scoop ups, a one Malamar line and a bunch of texts like Zig Zagoon and the discard Gearantina, the other Gearantina that you can actually attack with sometimes or just get the two damage counters on the bench, is really good. I was testing some peak roms some other stuff and realize it's head shifted really pretty dramatically to like a two shot Meta for sure. So yeah, my thought was, well, let's play the tankiest thing out there and do some busted super scoop up heels. And if you're playing the super scoop up, you kind of need the Malin Mar to like acceler energy every turn after you pick it up. Yeah, so I had a lot of fun actually sort of building that deck from the ground up. There was a million different Malamar lists around, or, sorry, Dragon Paul lists around, and what I notice is all these are all really weak to like energy disruption. So people are scared of the quote best deck and they're going to counter it with energy disruption because the Malam, the Dragon Paul List fell Malamar don't have any like. Okay, well, mine as Malamar, so that's fine. I don't worry about the counters is so much anymore and we'll just sort of set up put a bunch of damage counters on board and then once they get two hundred and sixty damage on you, you just hope you flip heads right. So it's a fun deck to play, for sure. It's definitely less consistent than like towards version that came out more recently, but it was testing pretty well for me and it was fun to play. I always I wagh that in quite a bit actually. If I don't enjoy playing a deck, then I don't really want to sit down all day and play a tournament with it. Yeah, because like, if you're not having fun, what are you doing? I like that mentality. That's prettying it. Yeah, so game is in the name. So yeah, so I was doing that. I was having fun. I played pretty well. I think I was well prepared for this tournament. I had a bunch of texts for peak around, since that was getting more height, which made it so that I was favorable against the bad peaker on what there were some older lists running around with like a bunch of GERACI's in the like, and you could take cheap prize there and usually you'd win with like Graci Dedenne and one tag team knock out in like four attacks. If you write spread your damage around correctly, and so I was playing a lava fet and a chaotic swell to slow down their early game energy acceleration and then I would, you know, spread the damage pounters around. I were going into troubled day too when I face the good peak around list that didn't have any GERACI and they make you take out a bolt on at some point, which just feel so bad. Placing five damages counters on Raishee raishue does like nothing and you basically have to do five or six attacks to win against those and they'll eventually build up enough energy to one shot you with Bolt Ond. So I wasn't ready for those lists and lost a couple rounds day too because of that. But everything else dragon falls just super solid against I didn't even flip well in super scoop ups. I just sort of set up and managed to hide damage on the bench. The Malamar line was really nice to just keep attackers going. Something that's underrate about Dragon Faull to, I think, is like the V is pretty good attacker height. He one hundred and forty four two and then, if you're smart, you can price trade and like attack with vmax first, then a regular V and they take that out and then you put a three prize reacted and like stick them with the Marnie to so they can't gust around it right anyway. So I was pulling off fancy plays like that, even with the bad luck on super scoop up. I had a good run. I felt great of all all my matchups except for day two. Started hitting those good peak rombs and there's just nothing I could do. Yeah, also, pigure, I'm definitely. Bigure, I'm definitely. was that like the call for sea? A lot of the lot of the high placing decks in that co yeah, yeah, for qualifier three. And the other thing about qualified three is I was playing. Like I mentioned, I was working a night shift before and then played all day and then I worked another night shift and then I started playing day to. Just a good idea. I don't recommend it. That sounds wrong, man. Yeah, I had a let's open, though. It's super, Super Slick, man. I think it's really cool. Thanks. Yeah, a lot of tacks and you know, ultimately, even if they wasn't the most effective against those you know, turbo peak around Dashi kind of variance. I think, think you made a really good set of choices. And you know, maybe the the...

...scoop up wasn't the the flip card of choice at the end of the day, but you had the right mindset right like yeah, and I think I executed my game playing well. I was basically I was beating everything that was not peakerum a second day. I think all my losses were to peak rum. So if I hit different matchups I could add a better finish. Totally, I sti really happy with it. I think I ended up I was ten and three day one and then four and three day two for like fourteen and six, and I bubbled out of top thirty two, which I was a little worried might keep me out of the invitational if I wished and que for, but it ended up not mattering. Getting just replacings over all, one of which is a copy, had me in pretty solidly. Yeah, I mean, talk to us about the quarter for and then what you were feeling after that finished. So qualified for I realized that whatever I did with dragon balled, I couldn't beat peak around. It just was not possible. So I had to find something else because I just knew there was going to be a lot of peak I'm around. I wish I would have found spiritumb for that one, but I didn't know about it. Yeah, and I was still working a lot, so I didn't have time to test a lot of new stuff. I ended up tottling on a peaker on list that was touched for mirror, because I played peekrm on and off, not super regularly, but you know over the last year two since it came out and there's been all these times where it's basically the best deck in format right and so I had learned over that time some ways that you can swing the mirror a little bit. So I did some weird things. I played my own Wab effet, which you can either put active and then you play Max switch so that you can pop the cocoa prism and then move the Waba fet back to the bench. Also played my own power plant, which you can always just choose if you're going to put that down or not, and then weight game you stick them with the plant stamp. Is usually a big swing. What happened, though, is all of those cool text that I had didn't come into play because I just got ran over in mirror by getting out drawn, like to a dramatic degree. Sure the highlight of the tournament for me was just feeling so helpless my opponent. On the second turn of the game, he goes speed, energy, Thunder, Thunder, mountain, prism, epower, epower, epower. Boss. Order my peak ram and full books for free prizes part in your hand and I had a good sort what I had to energies of that thing. That's pro power play doesn't help you. What they do that I think I'd save me then. I think it so well. Ultimately, though, at that qualifier, for I didn't impede your run into making it to the invitation. So we're was there any doubt, if whether or not you would make it? When did you know for sure that you are in? So good question. I was. Once I with, I did okay, thank you, for I went to like eight or seven and four before I lost, and then at that point I was out. Once I dropped to seven and five, I think. So I was like one went away from a win and in, but once I was out, I just dropped and then I started checking the leaderboards for like, okay, who can actually pass me and how many finishes, you know, am I going to be close or not? I checked late that night because I was working the whole night time. So look, that's the same man. That's crazy shit. I just was scrolling through people and some downtime and I was like, okay, there's only like three people, or for there are four or five, and day two that were like possible of passing me turn out and I was like tied for third at them. So yeah, I was like okay, even if they all passed me, I still like the bottom end of twelve. So I was feeling really good at that point. Yeah, cool. And then and then your focus, like when did it start to shift towards the invitational? I mean did you take kind of, you know, a breather week and then really get into it, or did you start testing like as soon as you figured out that you'd be in it's so I took a couple days and actually it worked out nicely that I didn't make day two in the fourth one, because I could take that day and actually sleep. So it only took me a couple days then to recover sleepwise from you know, one all nighter essentially that I did to play the day one, as opposed to qualifier three, added back to back all nighters to play in day two. Of that one. Yeah, don't, don't do this. It was dumb, but I already had a lot of points. So anyway, two days of like sleeping a lot and catching up, I'm like,...

...okay, let's just I need to find something new, because I hate mirrors and I'm not going to just high roll enough to win this. So I need to find something that like counters the Matta. I looked at the top eight and saw a spear Tumb with buzzwall and like that seems really good. Yeah, I didn't love the way the list was set up. I liked the scoop up net engine better. So there was actually further down there was someone who made day two, I think, with with a list that was closer to Luke Morse's from Celio's network. He played the deck and qualifier for and lost a win in it, but he had a really neat list and posted a video on it and I'm like, okay, this makes sense to me. Scoop up nets, Zigzagoon veltal with Buzzwall, and I had nightiligo in the list initially and the criagonal as well. Sure, like, okay, this deck just seems fun. It definitely beats PEA Kuram if you you know, get your sledge hammer turn at some point and it looks like it's going to be okay against other stuff too. So I had like a week and a half where I'd basically decided I like this deck, let's start testing a lot, and it just kept eatting better and better the more I tested it. With the initial list I was beating Pea Kuram, I was beating baby bill cephalon. You basically the martium over and over again until they have to do done and then you just win the price trade. That way you can do fancy criagonal plays if you want. You don't need it. So I just cut the criagonal for another extra great ball. I got a second skateboard in there because I learned the biggest thing in testing. That change is just how I approached the dragon pult matchup. It's a really fun matchup to play. It's really back and forth and if you make mistakes you usually will get the shop. Yeah, you really need to focus on keeping your spirit teams back in hand and be able to drop it and hit for you know, one hundred and sixty or weekns three hundred and twenty. Do that all on the same turn. It's really hard to do, though. Yeah, it's no, plap them down. You're like, it's fine, it's we'll just put it down and it yeah, goon, you know, Max the atom is. Oh, I lost my spirit team that. I got to find another one. Yeah, so I did that a couple times. Then like okay, we got to get better at that. I learned through experience if you sort of put some your gx is down and then even maybe get a shrine and play and get a couple damage counters to work with on your bent and you want multiple drapche's and play. You want, know, a jinks or two down, is really good. And once you're with all that set up, okay, and then at some point they'll take a knock out and you activate your or a Choreo and you get this big old hand and then you drop, you know, all the big Combo to the big knack out. The other thing that's really fun to play with, and that matchup, is the veltel. You. Yeah, for weakness with absorbed vitality, for just do forty damage. Yeah, and then you know, horror energy pokes or any shrine damage that's accumulated is like down they can't one shot you and then you get a free knock out there while you build up your hand for the next speer team come. So I learned if you play that match up really, really well, then it can be favorable for you as well. So now I'm thinking, okay, I've got this deck that beats the Big Three. That's pretty cool. I had to adjust for the composation. That one qualifier for I didn't know how to beat it. I was getting kind of close with like I'd poke four hundred and forty and then doom count gx, their first station and then the second zation. You can hit for two hundred and twenty, right, but if they get a third attacker you can just a drop to you to slap you and then next fit the COMBOS or twice like you lose. So it's still it was a little unfavored. The night before the imitational I was thinking like okay, I beat the big three and like little batting and station. That's fine. This DEX fun. I'm not going to play anything else. I'm going to have fun anyway. And then Luke is like, Hey, a Zules list doesn't have any stadiums. That's right, we should play black market. Yeah, yeah, I like, Yep, definitely putting that in. So right were it was six PM. I tested zero games with that card in the list. Yeah, and I chucked it in there. I think I had three switch which I didn't need. After the second escapeboard. Really need to. So I cut that for black market and I'm like all right, now I beat everything. Let's go. You were pretty confident. I mean you should be, I think. I think, yes, like absolutely, with the with the Dragon, Paul's kind of being able to finesse that and you have, like you said, that really solid match up against peak around, which was still, you know, on the table and the blow Cephalon like definitely not going away, and then now you have this answer to the deck that had just...

...won. I mean, yeah, you got to be feeling really awesome about your chances. And I mean you with the distance so going, you know, being the last man standing. was there anything kind of throughout that tournament, that last invitational, that you may be wished was like, you're sixty one card, I guess. Were there any cards that you wish that you had in the list that you weren't able to fit in? Not Really. Yeah, I think for that tournament the list was perfect. Yeah, yeah, I guess the evidence is there. I was even I was even ready for the MUTETU with mind report. Yeah, served a couple purposes. One, it helps you chain Marnie into more Marni's again Cephalon, which is really good. Yeah, so it was just straight up better than criagonal in my opinion. And then also you can recycle boss's orders to get around dolls and take out the draw engine, nilled x or small decks, and they can't even sleep block you either because you can knock out your own spear teams. So I was find against literally everything. I didn't end up facing chip. He was the only guy who play control. I was ready for that too. Yeah, that's what took Nice. That's the kind of confidence I like to see, man. That's awesome. So what I always ask people who have recently done well at tournaments? was there ever a moment where you felt like this is the tournament that I'm going to win? was there ever just like a game or a turn that after that turn it just felt like you were on cloud nine set to in that tournament? That's good question. I don't think I ever really got there, mainly because Luke was basically playing the same deck. Yeah, I was looking at the other deck list since they were all posted you out the sort of the tournament, and like this is mirrors just going to be my hardest matchup, and there were some close matches on day one, but we both managed to go three and Oh, the first mirror I miss played once and got punished really hard and then just drew poorly the other game and got Otu pretty quick. And like, okay, that's fine, I can beat whatever's coming out of the loser's bracket and we'll just give it another go. But then the finals was so close. Yeah, I think I thought I was winning when the first game of finals was a Donk. Yeah, the second game of finals, I thought like I played really well. Ask you to my game plan. My list is a little more consistent and that allowed me to pull it out. And now I'm like now one game, and at that point I felt like I was going to win. But it started going really poorly for me before. I didn't draw as well and I lost game five. I had a terrible start and was really scraping for attackers and that whole game I thought I was going to lose. Yeah, even when black prison start like black market stuck for a couple turns and he couldn't take any prizes and I ended up being up like by two prizes. I still didn't feel like I was up prizes. I'm like, I'm losing this game. I board's terrible. I don't know what I'm going to do. Oh No. So I never felt like I was winning that last game until the very last time when he whips boss's order. That would have trapped my mewtube and yeah, yeah, and then I could just retreat into spirit toumb and do a hundred thirty damage on Buzzwal. I like triple checked the math, like this is an yeah, I have one prize left. This is knocked out and I won prize left. All right, I had boss ordering it too. I could have gusted up and draft yours. Yeah, I made it way easier on yourself. Back Out, draw the prize. Okay, it's over, and that's what I do. I want that that very last or. I honestly thought I was losing the game the entire time. Yeah, well, I got to say it was a really fun mirror match to watch because the intricacy between black market and the shrine of punishment, you know, when you play which and then when you go in with certain attackers, like when you go in with buzzwoll versus going with a spirit tumb because sometimes you want to go in with buzz will later just because it has more HP. You know, there just a lot of and then, yeah, and using like the Guarantina to knock off the energy when you're hitting into black market. I mean, what were some of the plays that you looked at in the mirror and just to try to pull off? What were some of the things going into the mirror that you were looking to do? First thing I'll say on that is we did not test mirror once. We never thought about how these cards were interacting. Like I went back and watch the commentary to soult brothers had some really good criticisms of our plays on both ends. But we're just figuring this out like on the fly. I never thought a black market for some star in the mirror once until I decided to play it down since I was able to take a prize. And then I had a a dark pokemon with the dark energy and the act of Im like that seems good. There you go. He pulls up the Guarantina and discards it and then take surprise and like Oh, that's a good...

...play. It everything that that's pretty fine. So you're just like flying by the city of your bands. Yeah, we're just taking it one hand at a time, one pnute a time. We're doing what ended up swinging it was that that black market interaction was was big. And then getting to the buzz will sledgehammer turn is really good because it does have a lot of health. So taking the early prize lead, you know, can actually set up so that the sledgehammer works more in your favor and then you're able to take a prize or even two with it. Then that's how you want to do it, whereas if you're behind, then at some point your buzzwle doesn't have as much value because if you're hitting the their buzzle for one hundred and twenty, still need a Zig Zigoon to get the knock out right, and then as soon as they take a different prize than your buzzle is kind of useless. You only it thirty right. The other really weird interaction with the mirror was the damage counters on Spear Tom. If you were the first one to go up to twenty damage on your spear Toumb then the opponent we needed to do ten damage on their spirit Tam and then to take their turn knock out, you had to go back to twenty damage again and they only need a one damage counter. And so it works out so that one person basically needs to keep finding zigzagoon and the other one doesn't. And I still don't know in hindsight, like how do you try to control that interaction? It's just really weird, but it feels awful when you're on the other side of it. I guess it's like you have to probably try to use your own zigzagoon. Like yeah, it took to get back at even or to get tilted in your advantage. That's that is a really interesting being interaction there. At some point, if you have the bench space and access to Zigzagoon in addition to setting up your attackers, then it is like a significant swing to keep your guy at ten, put a zigzagoon down to bump them from ten to twenty and then you do a forty damage knock out and then they sort of have to have the answer coming back. And if you do that in addition to the Gearantina interaction with the black market. Now you're like making them find to scoop ups or two basics, you know, some combination of those in order to keep things going back and forth. But yeah, it was. It was a fun match and really Strange Mirror matchup that we expecting. We were joking the night before like Oh, friends and we have the same deck and we think it's great, so we'll just see. Well, I'll play you in the finals, not knowing that it would actually other side of the bracket and I will play each other in the bar. That's always the dream. Yeah, the dream. You know, you what you're playing to win. You might as well be confident and like talk like that, but it's, you know, tongue in cheek, you're joking, and then it actually happens and you don't know how to play the mirror and who knows how many people watching you sure, while you know, fumble over your own deck trying to figure out all these interactions. But that's a good problem to have, being a being against your friend and having the best stuck in the tournament and being stuck in the finals against each other. That's that's pretty great. Absolutely, absolutely, that's awesome. Yeah, and shout outs to Luke as well, for for ya coming up with a similar version of that deck and and performing extremely well with it. So so after you win, you just are very excited. What does it do? What does this win mean for you for like your confidence moving forward in the game, and do you place it kind of on a level of like a regionals or even like a world championship win, or maybe a NA see when you know, kind of an international championship? Your question. I've been thinking about that. You know, for me personally, this was my replacement for my worst schedule, is pretty good this year and I was pushing for worlds invite for the first time. I got up to three hundred CP before the season was canceled and I was going to go to both Berlin and this so I've been getting CP at every standard major event this year. So I was like right on track to go to world's. I had bought my ticket to London already. Yeah, so I was super excited about all this. You know, traveling pokemon, meeting New People, certainly get better performances. And then everything's canceled, which, like I get I work. I work in medicine, and it's what's the right call? To cancel them, but also it was like all of the fund was gone that I was looking forward to. So seeing the limit lists, you know Promo video that they put out, I'm like this is this is the next best thing. We're doing it. I'm going to give a shot and to come out on top is just yeah, it's pretty crazy. It...

...feels like I want a regional and it's not the same because it's online in the decklist republic and you know, you have like I never won a thousand person tournament. I I just placed in three out of four. And then I want a sixteen person yeah, sure, sure, but but it feels like I'd be all two thousand people that had, you know, entered in these. Sure, which is pretty cool. And then the other surreal thing is, you know, going to limit list like I do all the time, and then my name POPs up in first place, and then I go to youtube and everyone's like first place spear team deck and they have exact sixty trying to figure it out. Yeah, it's like, Oh, I made it, this is pretty cool. I've been playing for three years and and had some finishes here and there, but nothing like this before. And I I've known sort of internally I feel I'm a top tier player, but having a result to validate that is a big change. The other fun thing for next year is I'm going to have the limb less Invitational Championship, Matt, that I can tell. Hey, there the flight imidation fact. Absolutely. You may have heard of the Cham. Yeah, that's right. I mean it really was like just such an international tournament. I mean we looked at kind of the participation across the world and to be as consistent as you were over the course of for tournaments and then the invitational is really very impressive to me. So once again, just congratulations. And so we kind of look at the the big picture with the limitless overall and kind of the online tournament format as it stands now. We probably won't have for a while in person tournaments, and so kind of give me your thoughts on this online landscape. Do you think this is something that limitless should attempt again? Do you think that you're going to start doing more like pokemon stuff, where they are hosting the tournaments? Like what do you think about just this online landscape and do you enjoy it, do you not it? Kind of give you thoughts? Good question. I start by saying I definitely am a better player online because I have more experience. I played for probably year two strictly online how to build decks. I learned what was Meta what wasn't. You know, the need sets would come out and I'd slowly sort of get the hang of it and when I finally started buying cards, I felt like I was already probably an above average player. TRYM but my skills in person were just way behind. There's a lot that goes into organizing your cards and shuffling and keeping track of your hand, and the online system does that all for you. When you search your deck, it has everything sort of Po component trainers and then energy, so you can check your prizes like a minute. You can't do that fanning through a random card of deck of sixty cards, like it's a completely different skill. And Keeping Track of interactions while you're manually, you know, keeping track of which abilities you've used and then manually calculating damage. I mean it's you have five times as many things to think about playing in person. So I'm still learning to optimize that and get better. Online is kind of my sweet spot where I feel comfortable. Done it enough that it's it's second nature. So I'm thinking entirely about the game and not about any of these other mechanics going in try. So the other thing with decklist being public ads an entire new strategy. All Yeah, these tournaments, I could know exactly what options my opponent has to play, and I think one of my strengths as a player is analyzing all the different possible, you know, responses that my opponent might come up with and then make key contingency plans for those. And when you know their exact sixty you can do that extremely precisely, and so you know when you can make an aggressive play and there's no chance of getting punished. And then you can also know what are the odds that they're going to take a or turn knock out here? Do I need to prioritize them attacker? Making all those calculations and probabilities is something I'm good at. So the online game and knowing the decklists is inflating my performance in this but that being said, it's really fun. I think if we're going to do this for like really big money prizes, we need something with less bugs and more support from the parent company. That's like a highlight for me is this is not good enough for seriously competitive gameplay. It works for what it is. Everyone just dealt with the bugs. It's one game one in the loser's finals bracket for me, which I is terrible, but we didn't know about the bug. No one was playing black market wors Amazon to. So how would you know that that's going to come? I played your games with the card. It's just it's inevitable that that happens at point, which is...

...a shame now, but if it costs somebody at Twenty Fivezero championship title, that's unacceptable. So I think it'll still be a thing kind of on the same scale that it is now. I hope it continues. I know limit list was talking about me to get I think there's some merit to doing this. You know, maybe an offseason like away from any I see world championship season something else to get hyped about and play online. Definitely the next couple months it's going to continue to be a thing, which is good. It's a lot better than nothing, but long term there's potential that needs to be realized with probably a whole new program from scratch, and I know everyone's talking about that. I'm not holding breath. If anything, is probably used on the roof. But if pokemon wants to get serious about being, you know, competitive with the other card games and doing an online system, right, there's a huge market for it. That's that's one of the takeaways. Yeah, O, kidding, okaying. Yeah, that's just so many people and it's, you know, technically this is a grass rooms event the whole way through. So yeah, yeah, you got to keep it all in perspective as well. That's it. That's awesome, though. We talked, I feel like, with a lot of different people over the last few months about the is with TCG. Oh, and I feel like you've had a very nuance take on it, more with more indepth information. I feel like that we've gotten with most of our guests so far. So, and maybe that's because you've been an online player through and through from yeah, but that was really cool to hear. Likes awesome. Yeah, so I agree. I think you know, probably TCGO is the way to go for now. I really like the idea of doing something like that in that ANAC world gap period. Yeah, that would be Super Fun. I always feel like that period super awkward. If yeah, for people that already. You know they're qualified versus the people that didn't. It's like you're in as entirely different words. Yeah, that's right, you're actually open. He very cool. So, you know, coming off of this when you had a lot of success over the course of various different qualifier tournaments, you know someone sees this and maybe they don't. They've had similar experiences in real life where you know they're chipping away finishes but haven't had that big breakthrough yet. What would your recommendation be to them it? Would it be a like a testing element? Would it be like a deck choice? How would you how would you relay your success and ways to replicate it? Yeah, I can question. That's something I haven't thought about too much. For me, this is my fun outlet. Work is stressful and variable and, to be honest, there's a lot of months that I don't like my job, but it's just part of my training. I know what I want to do long term and I'm not there, which is like frustrating. Yeah, so pokemon is like a purely fun outlet. I see people get stressed, which I understand, about trying to metagame, trying to get the perfect deck. I think it's helped me to sort of be a little bit more casual about it, which is counterintuitive, but what I mean by that is you should play ducks that you enjoy playing. You should be constantly optimizing your deck and changing it and modifying it, not only did you know, get the right consistency and the right text and matchup spread, but also to you know, adjust for your own personal playste like never take a list online and say this is something that I can't change. I always change for cards just because I'm playing a couple of rounds and saying I need more bull search, I'm going to take this out, I'm not using this card and just adjust as you go continually, like I'm doing that process for weeks in advance. So over the course of a tournament I end up with decklist that weird, but I know what every card in there is for because I built it. Yeah, that that allows you to play your deck optimally because you put it together and you put the thought behind the other thing is if someone has a good idea for a tech or lastminute inclusion or something that swings a matchup, like throw it in the black market was fantastic. It won me the game. Against as will, bug or no bug, and it was the perfect card for that matchup and that was the only matchup that really struggling. So just keep an open mind about you try and stuff out and if you have a lastminute idea, just it's a game and you're having fun, just throw it in there and then do your best with each individual hand. I think you naturally get better the more you play. So I have it felt like a dramatically different player, you know, over the last couple of years, but like slow accumulation of getting more skills as you go along and listening to how other people talk about the game, reading...

...article from good players and see how they think about building decks and how they think about playing matchups. All of that just sort of seep into your brain over time to the point where you make better decisions and game. There's definitely things that I think of now that could swing a game or swing a matchup that I wouldn't have even thought of too. That comes from just enjoying the game and paying attention to people. Something that stuck with me from like two years ago. He go a Seagrove did an interview for with toward about deck building and towards. Said, if you play ten games with a deck and Pare for if you play ten games you're not using the ones to take it out for consistent as like a really simple tip. But if you're I took that to heart and I always looking for wasted space in my deck and looking to cut things out and again optimize. If a deck, if a card, is really important, then you're going to end up playing the for Spear Tomb, the cards that I was really wanting, or tap board said I can promote something with free your treat and then draw onnch cards and then see what play was correct. So having a sec going in there was huge. Having the extra great ball. I've always wanted an extra spear tomb and extra something on the first turn. Being able to great ball for some random things's fine. You just take something useful, then quickball whatever you didn't find a Agrin. So having two of those was was really nice just to be able to set up because so that's that's my advice. I guess is probably a long waged answer, but think for yourself and have fun and you'll get better as time goes on. If you love the game and you people, you learn as you go, then you'll just keep getting better. Definitely, no, I think that's a that's a great answer and I definitely appreciate your sentiment that you know you should be enjoying yourself while you play this game. I feel like sometimes people get lost in the sauce and in the end I feel like if when you stop and enjoying yourself, you start losing anyway. Absolutely, yeah, you know, you get more and more upset and and things go to crab ta crap. Yeah, I've at least imlay terrible decks that I really enjoy and I do better than when I play the quote best deck in format and I hate playing. Yeah, maybe that's cognitive bias, but also think you when you're having fun, you're more engaged in the game and you think of more things. So sure something to it. Sure, sure, that's great advice. So it's at this point in the cast that we usually open up to questions from the chat. So if anyone has a question for Kevin, we would love to ask him now. And cashman says, if not for spirits, womb or there any other decks that you were considering for the invitational question? Cash I love that guy. He's one of those guys that just has so much fun playing and he's really into what he's into, so he's a cool dude. Anyway, to answer the question, I was honestly considering control in untimed online format. It's really strong, but I didn't do it because I don't like playing control. The other thing I was considering was probably going back to drag a Pault, but it just the same thing scared me off of it, as it didn't qualifier for is you can't meet a good peak around us, and I think that's still probably true even with towards super consistent version. They'll just the one shot you at some point and then you lease. Yeah, cool, we have CFS. Eleven says. Was Voltil in the list for specific matchup or was it there just for, you know, taking knockouts that tomb couldn't get? You mentioned that. Obviously the UVELTAL is going to be good if you can poke into a Dragon Pul vmax and then follow it up with the GX attack. Did you ever find yourself using volatil and any other matchup? Oh Yeah, Oh yeah, lots of matchups. Sure you've altose there to be the best part of the deck. That's a good answer. That's that's specific reason for so this is something I talked about in like random youtube comments over the last couple days and I'm thinking about just writing out a particle or like limit list or somebody, because it's want to get my thoughts down. You know, in a way that's more concrete. But you've Alto gx attack is way better and the other ones that people play in this archetype. So let's CE Falon, the buzzle, Wi Fair Mosa. They can take you a free prize at some point like which is nice, but they're not taking an impactful knockout. You're not taking a big thread off the board. So that's a huge difference. The really great thing about Eveltil is you can take a knockout turn too. If it every game, it's not hard. You go second in every matchup other than like turbozation, because they can't attack on turn one. But vast majority...

...of matchups you're choosing to go second. Whatever they leave active, you can either not go to draw to you for a price, which gives you the aggression advantage, or if they leave something big up, you poke it for forty with your spirit tomb and then you push you belt all up and just dig for your spirit teams and with great about that is now you have essentially a free knockout and you're not investing all of your damage counters into a new spirit Tuam. That's going to get now right. So that second turn of the game is really important. With your belt all you can take a huge knockout, a tag team of emacs, a big gx as Ation v whatever they left up there, and you get two to three spirit tambs on the bench and start building spike and once you get that momentum swing, you have attackers for the whole game. You don't need Nieligo, you don't need dragon all or anything weird. You just need spear Tumbs that Blake Game. Hitting two hundred and twenty damage with the one prizer plus zigzagoon pricks and shrine like you're going to win every matchup if you just set those up, and giving up two prizes with the Veltel wasn't a big deal. When you have, you know, your two attackers set up now on the bench for really you know you're going to use jinks to take damage counters off of the voltal and then just you want all of your damage spread out on the bench so they can't get rid of it, and then you can swing for one hundred and sixty plus out of nowhere every turn for press of the game. That was my experience with the Volto. I used it every single round one of the invitational. I actually won my round one hustle belt play on the veltel. I had to bench it early because I had research as my opening draw supporter. Sur then he gusted it up and hit it for thirty, thinking he didn't want to get cheased the game too. I beat him with the you know, the forty absorbed vitality, and then do come. So he says I'm going to gust it up early. I'm like now you don't got that. Throw the belt on there. I jinks up to a hundred fifty dam and then do absorb vitality for he one hundred and sixty. That's got it. I sats, drag up foul vmax that one. Oh yeah, it's no Masky. It's the perfect card to counter drag a ball in. The matchups actually really terrifying without it. So so you think you treating three prizes rowing. You just win, but it's really hard to pull Combo off twice. They're taking out all your pivots and support Pokemon. You can't bench the spirit Tuam early like you can and every other matchup. So you really you actually need that round to I faced Luke metalsation and I won both games. I use dum count both games. The first one was against a frying can luke metal. So I put two damage counters on my spirit Tuam to do seven to drop down to forty after the damage production and then I did doom count for three prizes on the next turn. Easy. And now he's got to try to step another attacker and he's way behind in the fish street game over at that point. The other game he set up position first and he took a prize with it, but I was able to poke it for forty and then do count on the Zaan. They didn't have another attacker, but so he then had to spend two turns getting his luke metal powered up because he invested all his early energy and, you know, metal patches into the Zation. And so I just if ELTOL's a really aggressive card, which is weird to say, but it is in this archetype. It just syneresizes with the rest of the deck super well. The third round was on stream. Want to go back and watch that from the little list channels ATP Zation and I want me the third game. He left his ATP active turn one, so I poked it for a pretty doom count so that he couldn't use ultimate rate any point and then he prized all his metal patches so we couldn't set up a second attack. So yeah, it also won me all three game day one and then it didn't come into play against mirror or in my specific games against those will it didn't, but it could have. So sure, sure, that's great. That's a great overview of that card and I think there are a lot more uses than the average person would expect. I mean honestly, when you were talking about you know, okay, I would hit it specifically for you know, forty. They're active with spirit. To him, I'm that's a play that I wasn't really even thinking of. You know, I haven't had that come up too many times in my gameplay, but that's brilliant. You know, you would actually like, you know, if you had to attach a rainbow, maybe you don't build spite that turn and just hit it for forty and then you can bring up the Velta. You know, they're just little plays like that where it's like kind of counterintuitive to what you think. The real winning play is to do the rainbow, builds fight and then Jinks it to your bench damage. Then you could. I did that my game two against Edpz and the commentator for why is he getting for less damage? This doesn't make any sense. I'm like, I'm not...

...trying to hit twenty, man, just forty. S Good. He was able to gust around my black market game and bust up. That was the right play. So yeah, and now you have damage counters on the bench. You need damage counters on the bench. It's not a small issue. That's right. I mean you really like, I think some people think that spirit tomb is kind of this agro deck and it has that element to it, especially when it's pretty easy to knock out like a GERACI. But all told, like you just are playing the long game because the longer the game goes on, the more damage counters you can build out, the more you can build up your board presence, the greater chances of winning, and you just outline that very well. So that's that's why I bolt those good is it's you're essentially lead attacker, or technically second attacker, sure, but it's, yeah, the really game attacker to put pressure on and then you build up all your other attackers for the rest of the game. It's hard discycle spirit tooms, really, really hard. Yeah, that's only makes sense. Yep, gives that extra turn to build that spite. You can get a bunch of damage counters on your bench. Cool. So we have one other question and then we can probably wrap it up and you can give your shoutouts. Cash man coming in with one more asking other any other new text you'd recommend to add INS for spirit toomb? So maybe something for the mirror or yeah, mislaneys matchup that you didn't account for in your first go. So people are teching against spirit toomb now and it's not hard to tack against because it's basic or, sorry, special energy, single energy ors. So as my deck loses to chuckle gx, a lowland persion gx and Zircuit Tree Gx, those are easy one off texts for a lot of things. So you can counter all of those with one card. Play shadow box mimick. You you already play Zigzagoon. So you drop a damage counter on it, you turn the ability off for twenty like you would any so you kind of have to play that now, which is annoying because it's not going to be useful all the time. I guess it wins you maybe Mewtwo and new if you three is still around for whatever reason, but you sort of have to play that. Now people are playing basic energies, but that doesn't really do it for you because you don't have any way to search and Britty and would just be like the worst thing ever for the deck. So play shadow box if you're going to play it to any of the upcoming up and tournaments. It's yeah, that's the program. And then you get into the weird Lou or. Now they're going to play like stealthy hoods. You have to play tool scraper, the classic. Yeah, and mounts. Yeah, a little bit of pushing ball there until the decks end up both being horrible and and you just go back to spurs actually like draw cards. Awesome. Well, Kevin, it's been awesome having you. You've had a lot of really awesome insight really nuanced opinions. I think all of our listeners and viewers will be really happy to hear all the things you have to say. Is there anything that you want to shout out or call out as we wrap up today? Yeah, I guess I got a couple. I've been shouting out limbless peoples for putting on such a great event. I had a lot of fun. It wasn't worlds, but it was definitely the next best thing and if I'm being honest, I probably wouldn't have won worlds and I won this one. So I guess I'll think it as a minute. Shout up to my testing partner's friends Braden in Malan. Just random guys are met playing online and then we ended up going to some regionals together. They're pretty cool. That's last one is I'm going to start streaming at some point, so look out for that. I tried doing it once in my computer. Internet's terrible, so I'm going to upgrade those and then try again, but it's going to be fun. I think I'm going to enjoy talking as I play in interacting with chat, if there's ever a chat, but keep on out for that. I guess in the next couple weeks, once I buy a computer, because I have the money I'm just really cheap. Me Too, man. It's aw is, the king of being cheaps working during spirits on that for sure. Well, you got to get the new egg deals to yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly, exactly. Well, good, we look up to regional's. I joined at my deck B because it's too chief to buy pass yeah, that I mean. You're talking right to me, Bro. You're right, so good. Thank you again, Kevin, for joining us. We wish you all the best and future pokemon and streaming endeavors. Yeah, and congratulations once again. You appreciate it. Y's really fun. I had any such I don't see you guys, last one. I thank you. Nice to meet you. Nice to meet you more officially. Absolutely, absolutely well, everyone. Will catch you all next week on the next episode of TAG team. This has been tag team, joined by Kevin Krueger, and we're signing out. Peace. Tell You.

In-Stream Audio Search

NEW

Search across all episodes within this podcast

Episodes (149)