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Tag Team Pokemon TCG Podcast
Tag Team Pokemon TCG Podcast

Season 1, Episode 9 · 2 years ago

8. Sandy Eggo

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

All right, what is up everybody? Welcome back to tag team. I'm Riley Hobarton by my good friend JW Curry Wall, who is rocking out on his camera. If you're watching the video. D W, how you doing this week? I'm doing good, Riley. How are you? I'm doing pretty well. So for the audio listeners, JW is wearing what if hear's to be a full suit. J W, what's the occasion? I was playing a show tonight. I had a Gig and downtown Columbus where we were like it was cool. It's probably the weirdest show I've ever played. You were background musician to these acrobatic people. Okay, kind of circulay kind of thing. It was basically serked to Soleigh, but I think based in Canada. But anyway, they're doing this huge tour on the United States. They've been in Washington and Idaho and now they're, you know, Chicago yesterday and they've been just met slowly making their way down to the Midwest and they're going to do all through Texas and things like that in the next couple weeks. So it was pretty cool. There was like the ring people that you know got on a ring that came down and like swirled around the ring. People. Yes, there there were people that, you know, just just we're doing like big jumps, and then they had like a see saw that jump, you know, flip people in the air. They had this one dude, I just didn't understand what was happening at first, but he was being suspended by his hair. That sounds painful. I don't know how it works, but I think it's probably some like weird, you know, cultural thing from not America, where you suspend yourself by your hair. Yeah, I don't know. I don't know. Somebody could look that up. Then you're saying that's like a daytoday thing outside of America or or just like an art of performing arts type thing. Okay, yeah, but and then just some other sweet like jumping and stuff. There was a midget. I don't think you can say that. Wouldn't pretty sure you say a little person. Okay, there was a little person. My bad, I didn't mean. Is that really not a term anymore? I thought it was still a term. I don't know, I'm pretty sure it's not. Maybe I would agree with you. It may have been outlawed, but okay, a little person. Yeah, there's a little perfect. There was a man on the jumpy shoes. He had jumping shoes on. It was very it was very cool and that all. That the best part about it. We were just playing Christmas songs and it was pretty easy. So I got like, you know, it's under box for just being there, for existing. So it's cool. Yeah, Eder came in with his raid on twitch right, it's here say say our stuff. So well, woman past that. I'm sorry, I'm sorry, I didn't Realiz'M A. It's a sign of the Times. You guys. I'm just too old to w as a massive, massive boomer. He doesn't know anything. Well, anyway, there was a pokemon tournament this weekend that neither of us are at, but we did have some insight going into it. Yeah, that would be the day Tona Beach Regional Championship, so standard event down in Florida. Got To experience the beach the sun if you were there. So that's pretty cool. I'm kind of jealous because it's been miserable up here in Wisconsin and it was taken home by guard of our syll be on a deck that we didn't really talk about much at all for the past couple weeks. No, so we'll touch on that. And second place ATP a deck that we really ragged on a lot. There was a new, innovative build that Sander Perro kind of led the charge on, alongside some of his friends like will Jenkins and role ready, and that saw a lot of success. And then a lot of stuff that we did expect, like mute two and Malamar and dolls, saw a lot of success as well. So I think we just got to start right from the top. Man Guard of our sylvion. How did that escape our our radar? It wasn't really a deck we we're thinking about. Yeah, I really wasn't. I mean I think you look at it and you say, okay, probably doesn't be like Piggi Otto. It's probably really tough matchup. Things like baby blound's really tough matchup and even like maybe abilities are it, although you do have like the stamp plant Combo, which can slow it down. But I'm thinking more like baby blounds is going to be really tough for it to beat. And with so much representation of baby bloonds in in, you know, in in that tournament, I'm surprised that it didn't get thwarted in its efforts. I'm surprising made it out of kind of that sea of favorable matchup, but doubt. I mean baby blounds was the second most popular deck, I believe, with around eighty people playing it or something like that, or maybe this less than that, sure, but either way it was the second most popular deck, tons of representation. That's just a really, really bad matchup for guard of our. So what do you think ended up making guard of air...

...the deck of choice for this tournament? What was the either the innovation that brought it to success or was it just sort of a mashup thing or it hit the right people at the right time? What do you think went into that victory? Yeah, yeah, I think you look at, you know, on the flip side of that coin, where we say, okay, baby blonds is really big. How did it make it through that? You also look at how big mewtwo was, as, I believe, the most played deck it was, and it just really just stomps, it takes it to town. None of them do, I can imagine, or playing anything like lysander labs. So there were some less playing turtinators and stuff. Sure, a Turtinator, but even then it's like only one and I do feel like, you know, you need to use all your resources perfectly to be guard of are right. So you need to get that six energy reshus ared gx attack off and then you need to not lose that attacker while you can build up with your last three energy, presuming you play nine, using your last three energy to power up detertinator to try to get a knock out on the other guard of ooir. So that that's really tough to play that matchup if you only play, you know, nine energy, and so you can definitely win, no doubt. However, makes it very difficult, especially when they have, you know, the fairy charm. You know that's likes pretty good car. Yeah, and then I think the other thing too is obviously we saw a lot of success with ATP. A lot of people saw success with ATP. So that's another pretty good matchup, I would say. And if you're going to hit, you know some of the most popular decks, like mew to an ATP, those are some of the most played. So you can definitely see how the guard of our player went through a tournament with great success. Yeah, I actually kind of want to expand on that thought. Something that we said over and over on the cast is how you want to be teching for the top tables and not the not the middle to bottom tables. So if you can make it out around three and get through to see a bad matchups, and typically you'll if you can hit good matchups from there on, it's probably the right deck for the tournament. And I think the two DEX I probably ample like exemplify that the most were guard of our a ATP actually this tournament. Where's the guard of our now with the a'Mas Star to deal with the dolls a little bit better. Really actually is difficult thing for the current iteration of these dolls list to deal with. And there's more. There's stuff that you can do to adjust to that, which we can hit on later. But you have that for the dolls matchup. You do pretty well against ATP, which a lot of top players ended up playing. ATP, do pretty well into Mewtwo, and so really there weren't a ton of top players that were playing baby bloonds because of the fear that loomed overhead of this doll stall matchup, which is unwinnable for baby blonds. And so realistically, actually, Guardi ended up being a really good choice once you got through those initial trials of the tournament, and that's we saw to make top eight. Let's not forget Dean also made top eight with Cardivar. Yeah, that that's really big. I presume that they didn't work on list together. I don't know for sure, but that's just really interesting to see, you know, again like two different testing groups. Who do two different people come to that same conclusion and find success? Yeah, but let's shift gears a little bit now. Card off art does have a okay match up versus ATP. I actually think the matchups a little bit tougher than it is portrayed sometimes, and I think that was best exemplified in game two of the finals, where Isander was able to get off the reset stamps and stick some Caldeos and keep those chaotics wells going. And really you only need the damage from the GX attack of ATP. So it moves a little bit faster than you might expect, especially with the with the addition of that counter gain into the ATP list. I think is actually huge because it lets you more proactively attached to Keldo. You can just sprite one energy gx ATP and the meantime you're just building up that Caldeo to swing for one hundred and forty and the guard of ours are getting out three prizes anyway. So it doesn't really matter that you're right. Don't have extra prize bonus because actually waiting to be better. I was going to say the prizing, like giving up an ATP early almost feels kind of to your advantage if you're the if you're the eighty player, because then you just get the harsher reset stamp and it's like if you can get that gx tack off and they knock you out like then without really thinning their deck, then you're presuming like the way you win the matchup is like they you hope they don't draw into what they need. You know, presumably that the Faba right, which we did see, drew rip off of that polk a gear to win the last game. But yeah, the reset stamps can be pretty harsh, especially early game, because you're looking at a deck like Guardi wore that wants to take its time. They usually has the benefit of time to kind of set up the energy, get a lot of you know, thin their deck that way by just drawing a bunch of energy out. But then when you played against ATP, I mean you definitely don't want to give them too much time either, right, and so your troth kind of slower building up right game stay kind of decks, right, exactly.

And like if you're a guard of our player, like of course you take the knockout, you know, of course you would. On an ATP that is just gx, but then that leaves you're susceptible to the recent stamp. So yeah, so I think, I mean sandrew played that really intelligently and I think he really did everything that he could. Well, to be honest, he probably like he probably should have won that third game, right, like, if drew doesn't pull the fab off of the poke gear, then what does he do? Right? Yeah, I drew was on a very short clock to find the things that he needed. Yeah, so, I mean I I think Sander had a reset stamp that he tried to hold for a turn, if I'm remembering correctly, and someone correct me if I'm wrong here, but I think his intention was that that drew had just Cynthia Caitlin for a Greens and he would have two Greens for the Faba Plant Combo and then he could stamp that away and set him back two turns effectively. I think that was the idea. But then drew was able to get the poke gear into the Faba as opposed to having to use the Greens to draw into it. So for a little bit unfortunate. You could if sander did in fact have that reset stand, which I believe he did, you could debate whether or not he should have played it, because now drews drawn a bunch of cards. But I think it depends in your school of thought. There I don't think it was objectively wrong the way it was plaid. Sure. Either way, though, ATP definitely was a huge contender in this format, and I think the real big game changer there was the Rosa engine, was really, really smart. We talked so much about ATP just throwing up a three fries and be like yeah, well, don't, don't kill this. And what better way to deal with it potentially being knocked out then having a rose that are ready, and it's really clever. I like it a lot. Yeah, it's cool, especially when you're playing cards like custom catchers that are more Combo based, cards like counter game, which are supposed to be retrieved at certain instances in the game. You know these all these things now that make the Rosa makes sense in the deck. So sure it was. It was just really cool. It is really smart innovation and, of course, the the way that sander built his deck was heavily, heavily geared towards beating stuff like doll decks, for example, with the addition of the giraffe egg and the custom catchers, can't between cragonal custom catchers. Draft a like dolls is going to have a really unfortunate time. Yeah, we're really hard to deal with, for sure, so it's not it. Yeah, it's been good to see the custom cautchers come back to ATP. I think that was a change that people had been going towards. I know a lot of people had been cutting them in favor of just playing the great catcher, but now I do feel like you absolutely should play the custom catchers because you do want to chase down some of those non gx has, I think particularly of you know, the the doll style match up where you want to knock out forrgeous or you know their munch lacks, or you want work out like a Piggioto, or you want to knock out a victini or something like that. I do agree with with the way that the deck was built. I love the rose, I love the custom catchers, just really strong foundation for that build and I think that'll be the primary way to build ATP. Moh Yeah, for word, definitely, and I'm actually I've greatly shifted my opinion of ATP after seeing an action. I actually think, you know, we ragged on it a bunch for, you know, two or three weeks now, and I actually think it's it's like a decent deck. It's one I would consider playing now that I've seen an action with this kind of build. Yeah, for sure for sure. I mean sometimes it just takes that one cards, a kind of unlocked unlock the possibilities of a deck totally, and so we definitely saw that with with the Rosa. Yeah, for sure for sure. So I also do want to touch on those custom catchers and why I think ATP is an especially good user of them because of that gx attack right, like there's actual notable benefit to pulling up a non gx besides, just like knocking out a Pokemon, like, you take that extra prize, which kind of offsets the deck space. That goes into a plus. ATP is such a simple deck there. You don't need a lot in it, which look gives affords you that space to fit in for custom catchers were stuff like mew too now has such an absurd amount of stuff going on that is actually really difficult to fit for additional cards, right, you know, even that one extra slot, if you play three great catchers, that one extra slot is still incredibly relevant. Absolutely. You know where is? You know, with ATP it's like the have xander's list now, which is pretty tight and like well made, but, like you know, there's a lot of things that went into it. You know, there's a raft for egg, there's for custom catchers like that alone is a lot going on that only ATP can really afford that deck space. It rides me a lot of Peka Ram.

Yeah, it's super interesting, right, because you only have two of the main attacker in ATP. I have to of the Kel Deo and then pretty much the rest of that, the pokemonline, the trainer's energy whatever. That's like free game. You can really just kind of build a lot of different ways, do a lot of different things. Yeah, a lot of space x ATP really is just feels to me like a new age Peka Ram. It has a lot of similarities in the tempo of the deck. It has a lot of similarities in the like acceleration aspect of it and affordability of text. So that, granted. I wasn't a pick peek aroun family either. So yeah, I'm sure the vibe still till prepails, I think. I think my my view of ATP is higher now after seeing its success. I mean it yeah, very good with a lot players, but I still don't think it was be something that I would personally play at an event. I think it's a fine deck. I think if somebody came to me and I was like Hey, I'm thinking about playing ATP, I would say yeah, you know, do it, like if you're comfortable with the deck, like definitely do it, and if you're metagame shapes up correctly for ATP, then definitely do it. I just don't know that it's it's a deck that I would play. Yeah, I think that's totally fair to I mean this about has so many options to like you shouldn't have to restrict yourself to playing certain archetypes or decks. So ATP and Guardivoir, I really think they exemplified what we've hit on so many times in this podcast about teching for the top tables. Let's talk about what those top tables were looking like. Sure, Daytona, I saw we saw a lot of Malamar. I think Malamar was one of the most played, maybe the most represented, decks in day two, and that was a bit of a shocker for me. Yeah, I think in my perspective I wasn't that surprised at its saw representation. It kind of panned out like we thought it would, like there was a descent amount of people playing Malamar. A lot of them saw middling success and then one person made it to like top four and then lost, which is like that's just that's so qui essential Malamar. Isn't it like a bunch of make day to well, it was. It wasn't even like that. I want to say too, is that Malamar had no shot at beating ATP or Guardi like it just had no chance. I think you had a better chance of beating the ATP and it did it. Beating the Guardi sure, sure, and you could, you could debate, you know, matchup percentages, but like it had unfavorable matchups almost across the board and top eight. Yeah, so you know it. Yeah, exactly, we were. We were almost fought on with that prediction of Malamar being like that, that comfort pig, that kind of that safe choice that you may have gotten day two with it, but you definitely weren't winning the tournament with it, and you know it. Definitely. It definitely panned out and I think I think we could go to say, like you know, it wasn't even a bad break that it didn't make the finals or win the event. It just wasn't ever going to win. With them spread it's like you're right, but it hurts to hear to sure. So there was a couple different ways that we saw Malamar played, though, which, again, that's very quintessential. Alamar is like a bunch of people played a million different ways and nobody agrees on it. A couple of those ways with the most success was kind of a just a very traditional psychic build, Michael Katron with, you know, just audios to get that clear vision off. You have Guartina just stretchly swing, spell tags deliciousness. That obviously socks success. I don't even think we really need to talk about that because everybody knows about Psych Malmar at this point. Yeah, some of the more interesting variants. Not to say that it wasn't interesting that Katrin did involve the psychic, but some of the other sorry, Ketron didn't play audios, but you get the idea, like psychic Malmar. So the other parents we saw was Olcen ACROSMA was a pretty popular variant. Yeah, and it kind of follows suit with things that we've seen in this format, with like needing the ability to deal with large threats on the board. Not a huge fan of Olin acrossma your myself. I know that you've seen in at least a couple times on the latter of the passible days. I don't know if you experimented it with it yourself. What are your thoughts on the Oulcen acrossma very of Melmar? I mean seems good. I was seeing mostly from the tournament and just things on the ladder that people were playing kind of a thin line, maybe one alternate acrossma and one, you know, beast energy and a metal, you know, just a very kind of splashed in, not necessarily an afterthought, but certainly not the main focus of the deck, and I do feel like that's probably the way to play it, just because I don't know that Malamar or that ultnate acrossma has that many strengths other than, you know, just taking down things like guardivoorn ATP. Yeah, I mean more...

...or less I agree. More or less I agree on that one. Another kind of variant that we saw. Mike Morton played a ton of different sure, almost random feeling text but I've they obviously had all their own use cases, but there was just such an interesting combination of cards to see on a board. The one I thought was the most crazy was the snipy Venus or and when I saw chat and here in the commentator is talking about it, I wasn't really paying attention to what was going on and I'm like what. Yeah, that granted, I didn't know what the GX tag even did when this was happening. Something like I like the I actually like Venus or in expanded. Yeah, for the s with me in too, and they're just, you know, do fifty four one. But yeah, definitely a cool tech. I mean I'm not sure did he use it? I mean he can't. I don't know the other attack. I just know the gx attack, the first attack, I believe, involves a grass energy, which I'm part of my confusion, and the ability also involves grass energy. Sure, my when I was hearing this on the sun on the Stream, I'm like the secret for Ridian for a grass and attach it to like get the gust effect, because that's kind of cool, I guess. But alas that was not the case, unfortunately. So that would have been kind of cool, but but it was more about using that gx attack to spread against the doll theres sure, which I don't think we got to see that successfully happen on stream, unfortunately, but the threat of it was always there. He also played the fairy mimic, you with copycat as opposed to the ever prevalence psychic one. Obviously the purpose of that was to hit into Arcistaga, Palkia home for one fairness, psychic yep, seems reasonable enough. I don't know if it actually is a huge matchup swing or not. Have Have you put any thought into fairy Mimique at all? It's not really I mean, I mean it seems like the best like knee jerk play. If you think ATP is going to be big, I don't really see that there's any there's certainly not a non gx that I can think of off the top of my head that could be as splashable as mimic you to deal with an ATP. So yeah, I mean it's certainly it's easy to get the attack off with just a ridian and Malamar. So I don't I don't see any problems with it and I think, like more, it has a lot of interesting ideas that you can continue to build off of in the future. I know some of our friends, particularly at their pierce was very into I can Adel in in Malamar is a way to deal with stall decks, to activate your Le Cephalon. Yeah, that's certainly an option if you're able to get that off before the stall decks get off their clear vision. Yeah, right, because that seems like it just seems like that's the something that's going on a lot lately. Is that clear vision. Yeah, it's all asked. Yeah. So Malamar though, I mean I was I was impressed by by both its showing and and it's finish in the end. I think you know, obviously I didn't really expect it to win the whole tournament, but seeing it make all the way to top for was was pretty nice. and seeing that a lot of top players actually did consider it was was kind of cool. Yeah, as a deck that gets a lot of flak every every turn, it was kind of Nice to see it get some love. Well. I mean there is like little phrase like Malamar did, Malamar things, you know. I see that Malam our hands, Malam our hands, you know, and the the Lingo for when you get a bad hand. But yeah, it was really refreshing to see it so well played and so well highly regarded by top players. That was very interesting to see. Where there any other surprise decks or anything else you want to touch on about? Like the day too metagame that you saw the I mean, I think the most interesting deck that we haven't talked about yet. It's got to be the doll solid deck, right, I'm sure piluted by a ton of players. All of them saw a decent amount of success. Both in day one and in day two. We saw a couple different variants. I think the premiere one, though, was that Jimmy Penn, darvis grant manly list that made a bunch of top finishes. So let's just talk about dolls. I think you've been here. You've been big on dolls, dagwjw. That's here preferred stall deck, if I'm remembering correctly from our conversations. Yep, so I'll hand it over to you. What do you think of the dolls decks that came out of this tournament? We saw a couple different cool ideas in them. Do you think those will continue to be the play? Do you think there's a way you can shake it up to continue to deal with the decks that did well at Daytona? Already think dolls is kind of dead in the water after all, these crazy text of come out of them. Well, which specifically? Which specifically? which specific texts are you referring to? So, most notably, I'm thinking of stuff like custom catcher giraffe in ATP and I'm thinking of I'm a star...

...in guardivore. Yeah, sure right. So dolls was, I think, a great choice, like for the event. I mean we saw a lot of the top players choosing dolls and, like you said, it is my preferred stall deck. I think it just gets the lock much quicker and much easier than like Piggioto, but does absolutely have its flaws, namely guardivore is a tough matchup if they include the almost are and so you look at dolls and you say wow, this, you know, is such a great stall deck, such great matchups generally speaking. But we look at kind of what defined the tournament, the decks that made the finals in ATP and Guardivore, and they both had really, really solid answers to dolls in cragonal and Giraffe and, you know, custom catchers and ATP and the almost our line in the guardivore deck. So you look at it going forward, I don't know if it's going to be that well played. I don't know that there's anything that you can really do to avoid or prevent what's being thrown at it. I think it's just kind of that that deck where you have the way to the medicine on itself, where it'll be good if everybody plays, you know, things like me too and abilities guard and I don't know, peak around, whatever it is. When people play decks that are not ATP and Guardivore, then maybe dolls have a chance to to rise again. Yeah, I will admit I think the ATP is pretty tough, but I did come across an interesting card, I think it was on verbank today, that might help against Gardivar. So listen to this. There's a celibe in unified minds. Oh does it pick up? It devolves one of your opponents of all pokemon and shuffles the evolution into the deck. Yeah, so that could work right, and they only play one rare candy. So exactly. I guess that could do it. You know, do you think that might be worth including? I mean it's one energy, one or treat. It's second attack confuses, which actually isn't terrible either. Yeah, it doesn't seem so bad. Is that the is that a cellaby star? No, it's a celibrate dis a hollow rare from unified minds. Yeah, I mean that could definitely be good. I haven't seen that card, but I could definitely like if. But again, you know, guardavore wasn't so heavily played that I would be maybe worried about that in particular. I think I'd be more worried about ATP. I would definitely be more worried about ATP. I'm not sure what the answer to ATP is, I will admit. I mean no, we were talking about this the last podcast, I think. But saying Oh, well, well, you play one craagonal. Well, I'm going to play to spirit tomb and then, Oh, you played tutes criagonal, I'm gonna like three spirits and knowledge sudden her deck starts to look like a SIS spirit. It is just spir too. I there was one player actually, Nathan Brower, finished in the lower end of day two. He played two spirit team and two spirit to Rainbow Energy and actually said on his facebook post that he didn't think the second the two tow line, is particularly useful. It didn't really change anything in the end. Right, you have to imagine that that's true. Just because it's it's going to be hard to get up. Takes some extra turns to get a going ATP can always custom catcher it up and knock it out before you get the necessary amount of damage on your spirits. Whom to one shot a cragon also a lot to think that that. You know the tech is good in theory, but then maybe in practice doesn't quite work the way you want it to every time. Yep, it's kind of as kind of be like that. Yeah, I don't really yeah, I don't really know exactly what the solution is there. There's just the cryogals pretty tough to deal with and you can play like channelers. But that doesn't it's one turn. So you you know, you can lose to me in it every other turn, but it's I guess if you like get enough dolls out on the turns that you channel her, you could potentially loop that. I suppose you would need two dolls every time you channel her. Yeah, exactly. I don't know how you'd pull that off. I guess you could stack one the turn prior and then channel her drawn to another after Rachi and bench to it's not impossible, actually, I guess. Yeah, it's definitely not the worst idea, but then you have to like I need to play channeler in your deck, which, yeah, all right, and you have to play channel. I feel like dolls has that like maybe three and twenty three to six cards that it can work with, though. Yeah, so for sure it's just an idea. I don't know. I like stall that. Yeah, put in the rain power there is always nice to me, sure, but I think that's the lasting I really wanted to hit on them. We saw some spatterings of Cephalon gx. I still hate that that. I don't know if you have any fondness towards it, jw not particularly. I mean it may take a decent, too good matchup against cardivore if they're not...

...playing the ultra beast fairy charm, but you lose to ATP. I'd imagine just in that they can wall with Keldo pretty effectively against you. So not too sure what you're doing that matchup. Maybe it comes down to like a Stinger gx play and then you knock out their ATP and that's how you win. But even then I just feel like it's a lot set up and the deck already struggles a little bit with consistency. Yeah, that's fair enough. So I think that's it's more or less all the decks that we saw in day two of Daytona. There was, you know, a couple random decks here and there, but most of them had one to two players and typically didn't see that many high finishes at the end of the day. So let's let's shift our perspective to move forward then, a little bit turp. This weekend we have another regional in Sandieco, California. That are its San Jose? I'm mixing up all the same. I think it's in San Diego. This is San Diego. This is too. This too much for my brother Yago. Whatever. There's original California this weekend. I'm sorry to all the Californias so immediately offended by mixing up your cities. And it's another standard one. So this event no doubt, how he is going to have a huge influence into the the metagame moving into California. Sure, w what do you think is going to be your deck of choice going to California this weekend? If I had to play in San Diego today, I would choose Lucario Mel Metal. That that perfect powter deck for this one. Okay, it sounds so stupid, I'm maybe because it hasn't seen play since KNOCKSVILLE. But the Meta is perfectly aligned for this deck to work. I think heading into San Diego you'll see a lot of players opt to play the decks that did well and the next I did well. We're ATP and Guardivore, maybe mew two there. You can kind of lump that in there as well. Lucario Mel Metal has great matches because all of those things that it doesn't do that well against maybe blows Cephalon, maybe Malamar with a thick alternate across my line. But I just the decks that, if we look at the Meta share and what was played in in the last tournament. Looking forward, I think Lucario Mel Metal has the best match against the best decks back in the live age. You've got to lose in me here. So, like I see it, it's a Guardi. How does it have a good ATV matchup? Because they just don't do enough damage. They like three shot you and you can heal ull, but they can heal too. Yeah, but you just have more heel. I guess the Great Paces and stuff you're saying. Yeah, you have more well, and then you have just you play like you could play. You have room to play more healing. Sure, yeah, I just like you're talking the Greens, Weld Er, the car at all. Yeah, I don't know what I mean. Like I see the dirt, I see where you going. Yeah, it's like okay, so it's basically like metal, guardivore. Yeah, I guess. So cardivore has a good matchup. I mean maybe primarily because of weakness, but at the same problem is that Guardi can power like Fama plant and one shot at Keldo. Where is you need to get two different plants town and hit the Killdo as sooner they don't heal all the damage off in between. It's fine, it's fine, but but they don't want shot you. It's cool, and you have and you have HOOPA. You have hooppa to don't forget you, but this is like one damage and dies. It's right. It's like a weird matchup, but you're just I feel like it's not a good matchup. Man, you can stamp them, it's cool. Let mean, you can stamp anything. I feel like it's not a good matchup. You have to get way too many plants down at those kelts. thinking. I don't know, and whoever's been in my stream the last few days can vouch for me. I think the two times, I think we've played it two times with our Lucario moment, we won both. So I don't know what that says. I think it says more about the deck than the players on the ladder in this instance. But I just I feel like it's a good matchup. I feel like it's a good play. Yeah, for sure, convince him. You definitely didn't convince me. I do see your idcre logic process, though, especially I mean like obviously the Carmel. That will really give Gardavore a rough...

...time. Yeah, for sure. I mean, you know, and it's tough, like like we're trying to talk these matchups, but it is like the only testing that I've done, and I've done, I mean I've done a lot of testing since last week, but it's all been on the ladder. So, like I've not done any like specific matchups, and especially when you're talking about a rogue deck, which I would say Lucario Mel Metal is, like I can't give you, you know, exact numbers. You know what I'm saying. I feel like it's a good deck. It's it's a heart deck. Here's what it used to do, here's what it should do, here's the, you know, posure that I've had with it and what it's done. So yeah, I mean we can definitely like theorem on this all night and come to completely different answers, but it seems like it should be a good deck. Obviously beats handily the deck that just won, and so do at least play the almost oar line. You could, you could play the almost aline, but you're not convinced it. Well, I don't know what to cut. The decks already so perfect. It's a dead I know, I have perfect list. If you want the perfect list, just go to my twitter. I mean maybe we should control consult jamist out, because he's in he's in that group. Chat with us. That's true. That's true. He should. He probably asked some ideas about the car. I'm a metal. I mean if there, I don't think there's been a better time. I will say that. Yeah, I mean John Did bubble out of top eight, knocksvills. That was a pretty good time. Yeah, yeah, exactly. And then if you think that mew two will stay as strong as it as it was, just people like me two and it's so generally like solid deck, like it's very, very good deck, I think it does have just a number of very solid, even to favorable matchups. Yeah, yeah, I think a lot of the matchups, especially if you add an a'most our liner, pretty good, mostly just like baby blounds and atps. What I wouldn't want to see, I think absolutely. What what do you think would be the play for San Diego? Do you have any decks that are kind of on your radar? I'm not for sure yet. I don't think the metal was very odd and out. You know, there's like a lot of different things. This whole this whole format to me feels kind of like every deck's pretty good, but it has like one horrible, horrible matchup or maybe two, and I like you just can't really do anything about and then like every other matchup, yeah, I was like okay, or better. I don't know if you kind of feel that sentiment at all, but yeah, it sucks because it feels like the matchups that are bad you have a hard time even trying to outplay. Yeah, that's what I'm saying. Like the matchup. You'll have like one or two just really, really, really bad matchups that you almost can't do anything about and then like the rest of the format's fifty year better. There's no, there's not like a lot of really I don't know. That's weird to me. I don't know how to describe it perfectly, but I think you know what I'm saying. Yeah, and also, to add insult to injury, every deck is just super slow now. Yeah, they're like slow and awkward and Weird. Yeah, this is this is one of my least preferred the sun and moon format so far, I'm not going to lie. So, I don't know, I don't know, like ATP seems like a decent choice right now. It just because it can do a lot and a lot of different matchups and you can always leaned to Killdeo for like awkward gx matchups. I never really find it to be that harmful to just go back to mew two and play you too. That's been my favorite deck for the last three and a half months now and that's not really on track to change. If I could find a way to get dolls to be atep out of play dolls, yeah, I just run it back. Yeah, I would agree with that. It's just it takes such a hard matchup against that deck or Pidgy. I would I would do the same thing for Pidgie. If I could find a way for Pigi to consistently get ATP right, right, and then I guess that comes down to like the local metagame, to if you're thinking about playing and cups, like if you don't have a lot of ATP the maybe Pigi is a good deck, because I do think it it gets to it twin corright. Like it. It can mill obviously faster, more consistently faster than the dolls deck, but has a very glaring weakness in that you're leaving a you know, Neurrang Geru active or DRACI or whatever, Priggioto, every turn for the ATP to come swallow up. So it gets really tough. Yeah, so I guess instead of taking one deck, I'm gent. I'm indecisive until I lock in that that Dang deck list. I would say my top three, in no order, our ATP, mew too and Pidge. Yeah, and what would you tech in mew too to handle what we've seen this last weekend? What would I tech in me too? Yeah, I'd probably her subtract. I'm not sure exactly what I would do. I think the...

...list that are coming out tend to be pretty good. I think just having like a Turtinator, make sure that's in the deck to deal with Guardi and Keldgos, seems pretty good to me. Other than that, I think I'm pretty comfortable to deck. And actually, looping back to wasted earlier about the nine energy actually don't think that's necessarily true, that that's a problem, because a lot of times you can get the three hundred flare blitz gx off on a Guardi before they get like double farm down. So Oh, I see, I see. Okay, so yeah, I think the turnator is actually pretty easy to pull off versus Grty. So I would play mew two with a Turt as as if I had to say like attach, if that's even a tech anymore. I play the Turret. Sure, cool, cool. So that's what we're looking at heading into San Diego. Is there any of the thoughts you have at what kind of shifts when you might see going into that or you know what people might be thinking about? Malamar probably still stays big. I think a lot more people will cling to ATP as just their deck of choice. So be interesting to see how ATP changes, if it does at all. Maybe people will go for an ends resolve style so that they can try to gain a one up in the mirror. If they're able to hit an energy early and they go second or something, then they can get that attack off before their opponent. Yeah, might just be kind of the weird stuff that we start seeing an ATP list changing to try to beat the Mirror qui energy switch, also an option energy switch exactly. That could echo work as well. Malamar seems poise to just be well represented, although again we'll I think we'll just echo the same sentiments that we had last time, where Malamar's a decent, if not good deck but will not win the tournament and then, well, day we'll get punished for saying that. I don't I'm so confident that we won't that I'm not worried. That's most it. Yeah, I feel that. I mean, I don't like disagree, but I feel like one day they'll just be this insane tournament where someone just the most insane hands all the all weekend. Yeah, and it just high rolled the whole thing. Yeah, or the opponent's all dead draw every single game. It's like I always say, there's like a theoretical world where a theme deck wins a regional just because everyone guess it trus so bad, I mean, and there is really no more them decky deck. Then Malamar NECROSMA. I mean that that like literally is a theme deck. Basically, it's a theme deck. Yeah, you set up all of your little guys and then he like a help. No, it's like a double theme deck, Right. Yeah, I mean it's a double battle ran. I saw, yeah, them. I'd take it back. I think like the language matters here. It's true, sir, yeah, but it is. It is. Oh my God, yeah, that's an Inkay. So yeah, I mean I think Valmar still see representation, even though ATP is pretty pretty bad match up. Yeah, people like that deck for whatever reason. Sure, do you think there's any rogue surprises that might come out this weekend? I mean a lot of our viewers live have just come off of Andrew Stream where nuzzle right Schue just ended up went going three or three, one or four one. That's a that's a pretty interesting archetype. It's actually looking pretty good against decks like Guardi he's. Just build up a gigantic Richie one shot and then you go into the Reshi Rams Crom and one shot the next guard he rushi Rams crown. Oh Really? Yeah, they play like our heavy Rosa and Waulkner's and they get out the Reshi Ram lightnings or energy, switch off the lightning and attach the one of fire and just go whoooo. Really, you're dead row. It was insane. Um. Yeah, I mean that could be a thing. I think again, Lacargo Mel metal could be a thing if we're looking at rogue decks, man. I mean those are the two that just jump out in my mind. Yeah, I mean I honestly nozzle right you and look metal. They feel like they occupy a similar like mind space to me. Yeah, absolutely similar, tear in my brain. Yes, I think like maybe a heavier ultn ACROSSMO Malamart, like an ultra across a focused Malamar, might be good. That's kind of the other thing I'm thinking about. Just it's like to Ultran acrossman, to Metal Ergy, more like glass world's format, where it's just you know, you're playing at alternate acrossma deck, not necessarily like a psychic Malamar deck, with like a want of ultram across making a little more and ultra acrossma is definitely like the...

...multi prize attacker of choice. Right. Yeah, probably, I think so. Do you have any opinions on like ultra versus so Galle Lunala or Guarotina guard chomp or any other miscellaney's attacker that might exist in Malee? No, I really don't. Fair enough. Fair enough, I like the old truckers. You can build it up on the bench and one shot anything. We're to sound GUARTINEA guard chomp actually can't want shot anything. Sure? Sure not? Well, that that Ka. I kind of ware. It's like it can't one shot everything. Not that it can't one shot any because I'm important, because like, theoretically, can one shot somethings like like Peek Aram, screw that guy. Well, that's true. Okay, so that's a lot of indepth foresight and reflection on this past weekend and heading into next weekend. JW, is there anything else that we wanted to hit on during this week's episode? Any huge upandcoming decks and he random things that you want to talk about? Shadow MMM, I am just going to ask you a question, Riley. How excited are you for the Christmas party? I am very excited. For those of you who are not in the loop, JW is having a Christmas this event that you're not invited to, during the weekend of the Fu Ma, so you know. So, yeah, well, it's just like he didn't want you guy. I was advocating, like hey, we should invite everybody, and JW is like, actually, I don't want them to come. I don't like them and they kind of annoy me. I'm like, JW, that's really rude. I never didn't say all of that, but anyway, I jw is having a get together that we could of the fourteen. Then I'm coming back to Columbus. So if any of you are living Ohio, you can, you can see me in person. Yeah, we can shock her at the cup. Yeah, I'm going to leak up in Ohio, which just sounds like a killer time. It is. It just sounds two years ago, right. Yeah, yeah, so, yeah, I'm really I'm really excited. Although, oh, we also I did get to see Hamilton. It's cool, and you got to see Hamilton too, so we're like we're brothers in arms. That's right. What was what did you say? You're like overall review of it? What is she rated as? I don't know, nine out of ten. Yeah, I feel like that too. It's definitely the best musical I've seen. Yeah, it's a good musical. It's good entertainment. I feel like I've I've seen it, so I can tap into that cultural yeah, you cultural. Well, for sure. Yeah, Oh, well, and I would see it a second time. So that usually if something, if I'm willing to see a piece of media or or like read a book or see a play or see a musical like a second time, that usually is like the barrier for taking something that's good to being, you know, nine or ten out of ten worthy for sure, you know, because I like a lot of things, but I'm like, you know what, my time isn't valuable enough for me to rewatch. But Hamilton's things that I would do, that I would re watch. Well, anyway, let's open up the floor. Two questions. We will take the first five questions that we get and then we will sign off for the day. So, in the meantime, though, did you I have one question about Hamilton for you. What were your thoughts on the rotating stage aspect of it? I thought it didn't really add a lot to it really. Yeah, it was like it's okay, like it's fine. I thought it was really cool because it lets you like walk and like either be fasters or like move stay in place while also actively walking. Sure, sure, yeah, I mean it was fine. I just I don't know, it was fine. I thought I felt like the set, of all the like components of Hamilton, I felt like the set was the least spectacular. Yeah, it was so good, like it's fine. I mean that we're talking about like the you know, like the background components. I guess I think the costume design was probably the yeah, yeah, costume design was definitely good. I you know, the lyrics were really good. The music. Yeah, I'm excluding like the content, whenever. Yeah, I guess it's all content. I don't know how to describe it, like excludly doating, like they lyrical spoken part of it. I think the costumes was like the best part. Yeah, I think if we're act overall, best part has to be the lyrics. Yeah, there's it's very s particularly. Anyway, we're good. Her first question from creeping fruit. What do you think about Rosa versus bills in ATP JR thoughts? I mean, they both seem perfectly. I think it's just kind of, you know, half a dozen one, twelve of the other, or six of the other, I guess, and so you know. I mean it won't you find half a...

...dozen one, twelve of the other? There's a clear advantage to there. I have another one on six the other just seems fine. I would like to go down to the next question, though. Cynthia or lily, I do feel like really is kind of a suboptimal supporter for ADP. I don't know if you felt that way, but all the games that I played with it just literally hasn't felt the greatest because you really can't pair your hand down with anything. There's nothing really that lets you discard cards. You can like play Pokemon and play energy, but then your hand is just generally really big. So I never really find myself drawing more than drawing more than for off of first turn Lily. So I wonder if maybe those should just be Cynthiam Caitlyn's or something like that. Yeah, Um, I probably think the Cynthia actually might be better as well. I would have to get more hands on experience with it, though. To say to definitively durm means xander obviously played lily, saw success with that, but it didn't ever look like he was drawing a lot off of it. It never looked like super impressive as never like Oh wow, like lily hard, like Oh lily, that's looking nice right now. It is more like the like lily four three. That's pretty nice. It was all right. I will say the other thing about Cynthia, and I was talking to Jimmy Pendarvis like mid event and he's like, Oh, actually, I beat Xander in a game. It was a little bit easier than I thought it would be because he didn't play any deck refresh. So I was able to like very aggressively hit his cars, like well, that's that's definitely true. It's definitely true. So I always like the option to have like one Cynthia index just to refresh right, exactly. Yeah, so, and then to loop back start to creeping fruits. Mentioned there about Rosa versus bill. I would just like to pose that question to you, Riley. Oh, I like the Rosa for sure. I feel like the turns that you would bill aren't typically like the super like do you really care what you get off bills and you're playing bills that often, whereas like Rosa is happening on important turns, because it's the turns the stuck gets knocked out and you're getting not just trainers like you're getting other are important pieces, like the Keldeo, for example, is kind of hard to search out like when you need it, or Isander played, the mimic you, which is not easy to search out. You can get that whole mimic you Combo, as long as you have a switch out with just the Rosa Right. Right. I mean, I guess you can't get a rainbow, but you could play like a one of Ferriy or something if you want to do it that way. So it's like the rose of just seems like it does more like assembles a whole Combo at once. Where's the bill? Just like gets random stuff out of the deck right, effectively, like bills might as well just give you two, like to random trainer cards, for sure exactly, whereas rose is giving you deliberate things that you're choosing on important turns. And then, especially with the one of you know, you just you, we're more able to search those out. Yeah, you're playing one of counter game, one of Great Catcher, right. Yeah, it also, you know, like you can also get supporters to set up for like the next turn, like Yep, sure, just like good. I don't know. Sure. I mean it's a little more conditional, right, because you have to have something and knocked out, and like you're presuming that the ATP is the first thing to get knocked out, so you're already halfway through the game at that point. But you know, it is just that that specifics specificity is very, very strong. So I guess like part of my logic there as well. It's like if stuff's not getting knocked out, then you're in a place like you're probably feeling okay, and like you don't need to get like specific cards out of your deck at that moment. You can just afford to like Cynthia and Kaitlyn or lily or or Cynthia or whatever. Sure, the real magnet on says. Do you wish Stage two decks could make a come back in a later matter? Absolutely. I've been playing a lot of my cube with my wife, my heart goold soul silver cube, and a lot of those cards revolve around Stage two. So we've been having a lot of fun playing rare thing. I kind of forget what it's like to play where candy in this current Meta, but I do wish they would make a come back. Yes and no, I hate your candy. It just like it feels really bad after a lie on it. But I do like evolution dex in general, like even just circumventing stage to you, like stage one DEX also kind of died and I just think like evolution is part of Pokemon, like as the franchise, and so I like it when evolution decks are a thing. Sure, absolutely cool. Well, I want to take this time, Riley, to shout out our twitter. We should maybe get that as a banner, a rotating banner, but we have started a tag team podcast twitter account where we're going to be posting, you know, presumably just more often, more interesting topics. We would love it, if you're listening now or if you're listening later, if you would go and like that on the context...

...of whoever's listening at this moment. would be now to them. You know, yeah, I guess so I don't need to address you listeners. Right, all right, interesting, good, that's rightly okay, I'll keep that in mind. Well, we're at this out and be roll and in the others. That staying bro Everything. I would just like you do if you are listening later and listening off of Oh wow, I guess I don't need to do that. Proceeds to do exactly that again. Oh my gosh. If you're listening on itunes or spotify, make sure to leave a review, because those are super helpful for those platforms to get the just the more exposure and things like that. We've been having like some really good I've been asking some people like hey, if you really like what we're doing, leave a review, and they have and it's been really great to see. So if there are more people out there that do like this channel, do like this program do like tag team, then please make sure to show some love, and the easiest, the most free way to do that is just to, you know, thumbs up, give five stars, all that good stuff. Yeah, awesome to thanks to w for the for the plug. Yeah, definitely do, though. It's it's really helpful and really nice when you get those reviews out there. It does help us grow and continue to sustain what we do. So with that, I think will be bringing the show to a close today. Thank you all so much for listening this week. We really appreciate all of your viewership and listenership and we will see you all next time. Peace sounds. Good to see you, guys.

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