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Tag Team Pokemon TCG Podcast
Tag Team Pokemon TCG Podcast

Season 2, Episode 25 · 2 years ago

2-25. Dab on TCGO

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

The boys see Darkness Ablaze just on the horizon, but chaos has taken over TCGO. What is going on?!

What is up everybody? Welcome back to tag team, the POKEMON Trading Card Games Premiere podcasting duo. My name is Riley Hobart and I'm joined by my good, good friend JW crewall Gw how's it going today? It's going pretty well, Riley. I just heard my wife scream upstairs, so I hope everything's okay. Oh, no, duty to investigate the root, cause he said No. I think she's playing games with some friends. Don't be alarmed, but I'm sure everything is okay. Yeah, spoken like a true loving husband. What's going on with you? Not a lot, man, not a lot. You know, just keep plugging at the grind. I got my wisdom teeth out on on Friday. That was very cool. Just the top ones. My bottom ones removed a long time ago. Actually. Okay, that's like a why they delay? Well, the other ones are just for prior to braces and like the top ones, that honestly weren't even a problem. Like they I probably didn't even need to get them removed. But GOTCHA. I'm pretty good insurance and I had a referral from my last dentist appointment, so I just sent so why? Yeah, and they did. They had some pretty good like procedures in place for Covid, like as good as you can get for being a you know at oral surgery place. Yeah, and didn't end up to Lupid, no funny videos or anything from this. I just had a crown put on. Yeah, how do that? So it was fine. I mean it was good. I feel comfortable at this dentist that I go to. So it's very nice. They did a good job. I think. So far, so good. Yeah, I don't actually kind of funny. It's just kind of funny going into well, I cracked my front tooth and a tennis accident and so it wasn't like, I mean I did have I have a I like ap per pair of it's not really a full crown yet. Right, right, yeah, it's I mean I have bad teeth, but this one I just like needed particular attention. Yeah, and so I it's just very weird to do all these activities that we used to just not think about and then going into the dentist office, they only have you know, like for appointments in any one, you know slot. I don't know to our slot or when our slot, and so there's only, you know, five chairs set up in the lobby. They're all space as far as they can be, and then you go in and they check your temperature and they write your temperature down and then, you know, you have to wear a masks until they ask you to take it off. It's just a it's interesting how much of this stuff we took for granted and I'm just really realizing it now, you know. Well, I'm not realizing it. I'm not realizing just like this is my first big, you know, appointment, right, and so it's just interesting how this stuff is it is happening. Yeah, yeah, it's working out well because, like you know, wisdom, teeth and ribels are pretty like extensive procedure. Yeah, it is. It's like you need a ride and like they need to stay in the area. Is like part of the deal. And also, as a Sidebar, you're right that they only have a couple appointments in these places and they really don't want you to cancel or move them. Yeah, I don't. You try to, but like I ran into an issue and it's like how maybe I should just reschedule and I'm like, you know, my ride is having I'm having trouble finding a ride, like maybe I should just reschedule for a different date and like no, no, like your ride can leave they need to, as long as they're back by like the specified time, like just please, like come, please, come in. It's like I get it, though, like I honestly, yeah, but I did find a ride. They took both our temperatures. Then he had to wait outside. He wasn't allowed to stay in the lobby. Had to go to his car. WHOA. Yeah, and he just he just worked in his car for a little bit. Yeah, and you know, the procedure went great, though. I honestly, like you know, they give you like prescription pain medication as well as like the prescription strength advils or whatever after wisdom teeth surgery, and I never used any of it. I didn't use any of the medication that they gave you. What that sounds a lot like my I had my wisdom teeth removed in high school and they pretty much came out clean. I don't think there was any like acting or kind of crookedness that you often find with wisdom teeth, and so I had mine out. I waited like probably five hours and like that night I was eating soup and other I think I ate a sand which that night, like it's an ice cream. For like the first day I probably didn't need too I need to, just wanted. I just had leftover soup and ice cream. But then after that I was fine and like I never took it. I didn't. I never took even like a regular advil. I've pretty good the whole way. I was very paranoid about dry sockets. Yes, and still like I've been messing around with like a harmonica recently and like playing that and that's been fun. But like I was really afraid that it would give me dry sockets. They tell you like not to even use straws, right. Yeah, I'm like, is the act of like sucking on the Harmonica, because like there's an inward motion for harmonicas there is. Like, is that going...

...to give me dry sockets or something? Right, that's hilarious. That's so funny. Yeah, I hadn't thought about that. Yeah, of course playing harmonica could give you dry sockets. Yeah, so it was pretty messed up, but mostly just my mindset. But on it that's been fine. I'm just eating normally now. I I did, you know, as like a tick before my tie, I used to like poke it with my tongue where it was like sticking out and now it's gone. That feels kind of lame. Yeah, I don't know if you heard of that, but I dental procedures aside, here we are just mirror hours ahead of the darkness of blaze set drop, and honestly, it feels like darkness a blaze is is. People don't even seem to care that much anymore. I don't know, I don't know. I don't see anyone talking about on twitter anything now. You're right, you're right. I think there's just a general apathy and then you're seeing it with like the PC GEO bugs. But but that Prodoub is one thing I did want to talk about, for sure. But I'm pretty excited with darkness blaze. I think it's going to open up a lot of new things in the format. Primarily we're going to see the rise of Pokemon Vmax, which I'm really excited about. We're finally kind of stepping into this new generation. Right. They introduced v Max has, you know, over the course of the last two sets, but now we're actually going to see v Max has be kind of a focal point, I think of the metagame a certainly post rotation and potentially even in this kind of awkward two week format. And so that's what I'm most excited about, to see which v Max has come out, because I think there are some v Max has that get hugely buffed by some of the new cards that come out. I think primarily of the VMAX that I'm most interested to test that I haven't seen anyone talk about, and that's stone joerner. But there are some other vmaxs that I'd be symbol on the top right of that card. Or basically, I mean think of another vmax that has that fighting weakness that you would rather play it. I don't know that I can think of one either, probably. So in any case, there are some V maxes that I'm really excited to just try to figure out. Like the biggest thing for me is trying to figure out like a rose engine. Yeah, rose is cool. That is a fool. So roads is cool and that's what I want to really test out, and that's going to probably be my first like couple of days with the new format, is trying to figure out how rows can be effectively play because I do think we'll find like the package. You know what I mean like, is it going to be with so valley? Is it going to be with Rose Tower? Are you going to play a heavy kind of rose or you can play a light kind of rose? What's the support Pokemon that you need to make that work? You play a rang guru or not? You know, they're all these questions or surrounding rows and how to effectively use it. That, for me, is going to be the biggest question heading into this, you know, new set, this new metagame, this new format. Yeah, another the only other fighting deck I can even really think of, besides the God. Why can't? Why are I forgetting his name? Right? Stone Turner? No, besides Stone Turner, the is it gallery and Far Fetch surfeace? Know, but the deck I'm thinking of is the Santacona deck. But the as far as like the one I'm trying to get to, but the the one I'm blanking on, is the's little curvy looking guys, you know, like the Pacimi and knockoff timmy and knockoff yeah, the team. You really, you really let me down to this one. Failing no, I I like, Oh, Felix, yeah, of course, you suck man, you suck. I really, I really needed you to be there for being that I was trying to think of. I was like what v Max is? No, I was talking about Max. It's talking about just like fighting pokon in general. That's on you. I feel like the curdie looking guys who are vacific and knockoffs. It should have been more than enough to get you there. Fair enough, fair enough, they do. You could event you could have given me like a hint, like another name for a Roman battle formation, but I didn't know it. I was well, if I do it as a road battle formation, they would have known it was failings. They wouldn't need to whatever. But Santa Con is like the only other fighting type deck besides failanx and so journ. I can ye, go. Yeah, well, I'm not too I mean, I'm excited to try these fighting because I think like the format is kind of going in this in this direction where it's kind of there seemed to be a lot of very strong, very powerful pokemon rising up that are weak to fighting. You think of things like eternity is, you think of things like Vka Vol, I mean, and then in this weird to week format, you have...

Peka Ram and you have toxtricity and so he is really getting hurt by this. So Anyway, I'm lucky. Anyway, there is there's a lot of things that people are excited about that are weak to fighting, and I just think it's a good opportunity to try to explore that. That's the card that I'm most interested in as kind of like if everyone goes right, then I can go left with this card. Sure, and that's why I'm looking forward to yeah, I'd rather place. I'd rather play Santaconic because it's more height. You'd rather play Santaconda? Huh? Yeah, it's definitely more height. Well, how would you play Santaconda with the colossal man? It's so cool, m but how would that? It doesn't get any better. No, turbo patch may be a terrific but I'm just thinking this is cool. It's sick. Are you going to be getting a lot of the new set? Riley, a lot of the new set, like physically TCG? Oh, I'm not really buying a lot of physical cards right now just because I don't know realistically, when the next time I'll get to use them is. Unfortunately, I do plan on loading up my tcgo again, as I do every set, even if I are. Yeah, don't use it a time right, and I use it a decent amount and more recently, but like really right clash, I loaded up and like didn't do anything with it right right, because I was so busy. Whatever, though. Yeah, I don't know the actual darkness ablaze cards. Besides like turbo patch and the rows stuff, I think rose tower is actually really sick card, especially I love it's very good. Yeah, it should. It should be very good. I mean we've seen this same effect on our rang guru in the past and that was, you know, the instruct was a staple and a lot of decks even as a one of but now we have the stadium card, maybe has a little bit of a different use and you know, obviously it's not Pokemon, but in your opponent gets access to it. But it should open up some various new avenues to play. And again we think of this combo with rows. That should be very potent. Yeah, and I don't know if rose tower is going to really come out swinging because it you know, your hands are pretty big in this format, but I just I like the card. I could see it having longevity or like some niche value at some point, even if it's not like an immediate thing. So yeah, Sun, I'm a fan of rose and the rest ower. I will beat what I do want to talk about, before we get too deep in the darkness of Lazer Rabbit Hole. You referenced it earlier. I mentioned that. I want to talk about it is the tcge oh catastrophe that happened today. It's now granted as we are recording this. It seems like a lot of it has been fixed, according to twitter sources. But for those of you who are unaware or like haven't seen this going on earlier today, there is a patch and tcg oh. I don't know exactly what they were doing with this patch because darkness the place. Cars were already in the client. I guess they're just updating it. They putting in the tournament keys and stuff, but I don't really know why, why now was like the time to do that. But somehow the act of adding in tournament keys just broke like every card. And the way I think it actually happened, I think David Hawkman put, is it David to be the way he summarized it on his twitter. I think is about right where the car base. These cards are basically storing like variables of what they're pointing to. You know, like if you scoop up net, this group of net is storing that is pointing see like a Zigzagoon, and then it acts upon that storage. But I seemed like individual copies of cards were like permanently storing its target. So if you recycle them with like a vvs seeker or a save a liar and a Wrang Guru, it would continue to target that original target no matter where they were, if they are in the deck, if they're in the discard, if they're in the prizes and their hand, like the effect would carry out no matter what you're there's these crazy cliffs and if you haven't seen these, you like you have to just scroll through twitter and look on these. Everyone. He's listening. Yeah, but you know, scoop up net was scooping up entire boards. People were playing clay and it was discarding all of their prize cards, but people were weldering like pokemon from their discard pile. It was, yeah, lutely insane. Yeah, things are going on the just I mean it made the game unplayable, but the it was pretty funny some of the stuff that was a like. I love the one where a guy played an a z and it just, yeah, scooped up his entire board. He just lost immediately like that. Just don't want it is so funny and I don't know how tournament keys played into that. Sure, surely? Yeah, I'm glad it did, because it was very interesting to watch. I was cracking up today just throughout the day watching these crazier and crazier clips so that people were...

...making. Yeah, I think one of my favorite ones was this guy, like you know, he stored a bunch of clays and he clayed away his prizes except for one, and then you first Gx to take the last course. So busted. That's like a turn. One win every time. It was so funny. And another one that I really liked was the clay got rid of all the guy's hand and all of his prizes, and then every card he drew thereafter went into the prizes, so he had like ten prizes or something. Well, kind of, but like the prizes also became invisible, so they were just kind of like going to the neget rail or something like. It was insane. That's wild, wild. Needless to say, some major patches were needed. It seems like, as of the recording of this video, that most, if not all, have been taking care of which it would lead me to believe that they either had like an allhands on deck, like emergency coding session or that it was a minor error that just kind of interacted with the game in a way that they could have never predicted, and it's it's unfortunate that it happened and like it's kind of scary to think that you know, on the eve of a set release that all this stuff could go wrong. I mean it just makes you think about you know, if they have with and it's strongly applied with these tournament keys, that they'll have many more tournaments in the future. This is really scary to think that they could patch something that would completely ruin the game and render it unplayable. I mean, I was definitely a fan of watching it unfold, but it was kind of disheartening and I feel like we have harped on tcg Oh a lot on this part podcast over the last few months and you know, I don't want to beat a dead horse here. We've already talked about how, in the current state it's not ready, but this was definitely like a re emphasizing of that, like even if they fixed most of the bugs, or even all of them that were directly related to whatever happened it, ultimately, like it doesn't even matter. Like these, you know this, we keep running until a lot of game breaking bugs, and this one got addressed quickly, but you know, we had other examples that lasted for months and months and months, beast energy being an infamous example. So I don't know, I don't know. I would love to see it and I think this really push a lot of people over the edge and having that dialog and trying to figure out like what needs to happen. Ultimately, like we don't have an immediate solution at the end of the day, right, like we are not TPCI. We can't say, and you know, TDC I also contracts this, and so we can. We can obviously, like as a community, we can, you know, Sol of our complaints and and you know, use the appropriate channels, be a support tickets or, you know, twitter or whatever, to voice those but you know, we're kind of trapped and it seems like the intent, though, is to push more competitive stuff, like you're saying, with the tournament keys now so it's kind of like you're a little at odds of yourself here. Yeah, yeah, you're kind of right. You're pushing these two different messages, intentionally or unintentionally. I mean, the intentionality is there. We see the tournament keys. I think there's a lot of speculation on what those could mean. There's obviously like a very there are two sides, like two ways that tournament keys could go. Like on the one hand, tournament keys could be something that they just give out for free, you know, and you get, say ten tournament keys for every month or something in at the end of the month, if you've used your tournament keys like the best, you know hundred players or whatever, get to go into a separate invitational only tournament. Like that would be the best case scenario for tournament keys. And then, like worst case scenario could be something like you had the by tournament keys or something, you know, and then do you redeem that for ways to play in more anyway, there's ways that the tournaments can, Ke's can go, but putting that out shows me that they do want to have more competitive play in the game. But then on the flip side of that, whether I mean they obviously didn't intend for the whole game to crash the way it did, but they're sending another message that they just don't really care that much about the game. Like if you're going to publish something like that, we're going to put something like that out in the world, and I'm talking about the bugged client that we saw for the better part of I don't know, twelve hours today, that if you push that out in the world, intentionally or unintentionally, you are saying to your fans and to the people that play the game, like we really don't care about this, and that's that's disheartening, that's concerning and I just hate to see it. And what I think ultimately the real conflict is is...

...like, you know, you can have these tournament keys and you know the the Players Cup rewards that they passed out to everyone who participated today. You know, they said Autumn Players Cup in it, so like, or maybe it was summer whatever. They said, like a seasonal players cup and suggesting that there would be future players cops. Is The idea, and tournament keys also implies that. But time and time again we've run into the conflict where this client isn't really suitable for tournament play, and so if you want to push tournament play, you have to actually upgrade your system. And whether that means like we need to find a new DEV team or hire more developers, to me there's two strapped on people like I can't say what that what the root cause that is. To me it seems like a lot of the things that were we ran into today, we're things that probably could have been found with like relatively simple Qa m, and that's and I don't want to attribute like nofeasance to these developers. I'm sure like they're trying their hardest and they mean well, but, you know, could be a staffing issue or, you know, lack of priority or whatever. Sure, at the end of the day we don't know. The only thing that we know is what was put out, and so, like, it's true, it's hard. You know, I I we are are trying to put out this kind of air of positivity or trying to give a lot of, you know, credit where credit is due for what we have. I think we both are very thankful for what we do have, but at the end of the day, you know, what you put out is what you're ultimately judged on, and the product that we received today let a lot of people down and simply, I mean wasn't acceptable for a company this size of Pokemon. Yeah, I mean, if you're this size and you're putting out something that could affect any card, like Qa, should should hit that like you should have. You should be testing or your cards and like seeing that these things are happening. It's water under the bridge. Yeah, at least they've taken the active step of like, yesing it as soon as very, very happy that that has have and that needs to happen, obviously with, you know, tomorrow coming up, it's big day, darkness ablaze coming out. Just needed to happen make sure that these problems didn't persist into the weekend. Yeah. So another interesting topic, though, on the topic of like Pokemon company is they also have come up with their own podcast. Kind of stepping on our turf a little bit here. I don't think they would say as much as we say about the client. But no, no, for sure, not, for sure not. But yeah, this is a very cool thing. If you guys haven't heard, there is a new POKEMON trading card game. Well, not exclusively trading card game, but trading card game podcast that comes out every Wednesday and it's on twitch and also on Youtube and also on spotify, Google and itunes. If it sounds familiar, that's right, it is because we have done that for the last two years. But this is not a bitter statement about that. I think this is very cool. I'm stoked to have pokemon come into the podcasting sphere and to have all the these great minds come together and give their takes, be it people that you know commentate. It's a lot of commentators for BGC and TCG, some people that work at the company giving their thoughts. I think this is going to be a great medium, a great avenue for Pokemon to reach a broader base. I think it's super cool. You know, I appreciate pokemons willingness to like, not only take advantage of sort of like quarantine home time. And you know, if you if you saw any of the podcasts they like, you know people are recording from their homes and like there's a lot of production value going into it, like they're trying really hard to take advantage of of the people who know stuff about the games that they have at their disposal. I guess you could say I don't disposal sounds kind of worse than maybe it didn't end, but sure, it's super cool. I appreciate them like trying to delve more into content. It harkens back to some of their more recent articles that they've done that's been run by, yeah, you know, Christian Mansky, stuff, Abanav like these really good players that they pulled into these articles, and now they're pulling in some of their more familiar faces and their staff to do this podcast. And you know, I haven't listened to the episode yet. I have seen some clips of it. I think it's cool. I think it's really cool. I'm yeah, I do that. I did get the I did get the chance to listen to part of it today. I skipped ahead to the TCG portion and I thought, you know, it is a great overview of the metagame and kind of unique decks and maybe things that people weren't expecting if they've been following along over the course of the last few weeks in the...

Players Cup. I thought it was well done for, you know, for what it is, being this kind of metagame podcast. I hope that they do branch out though, and explore different topics. It seems that it's going to be a seasonal cast for these kinds of you know, players Cups, if they do decide to have, you know, future ones, and so, you know, there is an end date to this. I believe it was September ninth, as what I read on pokemoncom. But even so, it would be kind of cool to see this kind of be a year round thing where they maybe go into different topics instead of just making it, you know, for episodes based around Players Cup and that's it. You know, would like to see them, much like this podcast, go into some more unique, interesting topics. Yeah, I'm guessing that they're engaging as well, like using this time to figure out what exactly they're getting out of it and if people are consuming it. And I don't know if easily prerecorded and they've like because there is a lot of production value from what I've seen right but you know, regardless, I think right now they're doing a trial period. If it's wildly successful, especially if they need more players cops in the future, I think there's a pretty easy opportunity for them to continue that effort and you know, they have the framework all there. It would be a shame to see them work on all that and like kind of put it away. Yeah. Well, I think also that if you're listening and you love tag team, then you know, I think there could be opportunity for collaboration in the future. How cool would that be for us to be with, you know, play Pokemon, do you know, either hosting one of their podcasts or being on one of them? I mean that just be so cool. I'm excited for that and just kind of the possibilities, not just for us but for fan and player engagement. I think it could be really cool if they bring in, you know, certain people. I would love to see top players be interviewed or just put in maybe unique settings that only play pokemon can bring about. Yeah, yeah, I'd love to see them use the resources that they have and like to their full extent. Right. But you know, we do say a lot of trash about TCO clients, so maybe we're not the best candidates. Have we dune dug ourselves too big a hole by down at this point? We might have at this point. That being said, you know, I still think it's a cool it cool endeavor. I'm excited to see them carry that out. You know, it's it's kind of tough. People were criticizing it on twitter. I felt kind of bad because, you know, the teams who are working about on these podcasts are not the same teams we are working on development for the DCG out Bryant. Right, it seems kind of unfair to conflate the two. Right, for sure, but I you know, regardless, I think it's fun. I think it's fun. I think more people should, you know, keep a clear mind about themselves, like they're doing their best. You know, the client itself is disparate from what they're trying to do with like content and the pent seen and all that. Oh, for sure, for sure. So I think now is a good segue, though, too. You know, we talked about the recent going on, but I like to dig a little bit deeper in a darkness to plays. Obviously you haven't had a much of a chance to test since you were in your isolation period. That's right, a lot of wisdom from the Wilderness I did. Yeah, how to let things go? Yeah, primarily. Yeah, I realized in my isolation just how much kind of pent up feelings I had just about kind of things that don't matter. I don't know. It's just kind of weird. You get away from social media and you get away from, I mean even like friends or certain friend groups. Not to say that our friend group is bad by any means, but you just kind of come back and like a refresh mood and really real I was like, okay, this is very important, this is very important, this not so important. You know that other thing not so important. So it really kind of cleared my head. But yeah, darkness blaze, I am stoked. I am. I'm always excited for these new particularly for the post rotation format. I'm really, really excited anytime there's a rotation. And I just have a question for you, Riley. If you're going into this new format, be it the two week format or the post rotation format, kind of what are your thoughts on how you should test for the formats? And you can choose either one, but what are kind of some initial thoughts that you have on testing for a new format? Sure, I think testing from a for a new format you always start with what you know is good in works and work from there. Right. So a...

...good example is, you know, heading into world's last year, you knew that Peka Ram was going to be a huge factor and was it clearly a good deck, regardless of what happened in unified minds. So that was where you can start from and you kind of build everything out from there. I think that's generally the framework you should use when you head into a new format. Like what is the current Titan? What stands up to that? How do you deal with all that moving forward? And so in this format, what that would spell as a lot of these like Zashi in variance, that drag, a poole variants, dragon poll obviously taking a huge hit, to the fact that darkness ablaze features the Dark Cards. Yes, absolutely, names set darkness ablaze. So but still, like those are solid archetypes that you can fall back on and serve as a basis for your testing. Even Peeker, I'm still is like something that you can use as a basis for testing. Yeah, lost a little bit of footing, but still, and then from there you can do sort of the the build a deck archetypes, you know, every we've talked about this a couple times in the podcast, where there is clearly out of the set archetypes that you can utilize and work with. So classic example would be a turn of this vmax with Crowbat and HOOPA. I like that's clearly something as being like set up for you, like take the hint and try it out. Yeah, right, so, you know, take the obvious combos, work from there and then once you start to get a feel for what's already good and what's changing in those, in those decks, and once you get a feel for like the obvious choices and what works in them, then you can actually get into the thing, like into the weeds and think, oh well, okay, so you know, turn this is really good, this is the engine that I've solidified for it. Now, having played it against existing good archetypes, let's now try some these counter decks. You know, let's play the failings of the world, let's play, let's play the stones j earners of the world and the Santa Condos, and maybe you see that those decks are really good and they benefit a lot from this new car and the set of well, then you can start testing out sort of more the triangular kind of that is where maybe there's some deck that beats those and a turn this beats up on those. I think that's really the way that you have to dive into sets, is start with no quantities and expand your horizons from there. If you try too hard to immediately dive into the deep end. Then you end up a little lost. And Yeah, you can definitely get lost in the sauce. I was just going to bring that up. Is that if you go too far in just Oh, if you stray too far from the light, you're just going to be stuck like fumbling through the darkness. So I would very poignant quote. That's good, good for Pokemon in life really, but I would stay close to the close to the chest. Play the ATPS, play the peak roms, like you said, play the things that pokemon is literally throwing at us, that they want us to play. I mean we saw, you know, in the in the rebel clash, drag a pult eventually turned out to be, you know, a tier one deck, arguably the best deck in the format. I you know that some people might say that it was the best I can the format. And then I think we now are moving into okay, it turn it is being that kind of thing that, you know, pokemon just really wants us to play. And so go with those kinds of things, find the basis of what the metagame like, maybe should be, is the wrong word. I don't quite know how to how to articulate what I mean, but find the strong pillars of the format and then branch out from there. Yeah, exactly, and it's exactly how I would I would like rephrase that a reframe it. Yeah, the problem is and granite like this isn't a slight like if you want to dive in a crazy stuff right away, that's fine, like all more part to you. What I think is bet like from an efficiency and like beneficial to your testing standpoint, not the same as like just playing for fun and not the same as just playing the decks that you want to try out, is that you start with those pillars. And what that'll help is when you get into more of the weeds and think of the crazy decks, when you build the spiritumb decks of the world death, you'll have a really benefit so much from knowing what the big decks to look like, play like, how they act like. You can't, you can't form a good basis for how those decks should be played until you have the big boys ready, and you just like the big boys. They start off at least relatively obvious as far as like the cores of them. Sure, sure, absolutely. So that's how I would approach it. I think you're relatively similar in that approach. Yeah, well, because it's I mean you're kind of building a yes, we're adding a new set, but when you look at it in like the ratio of new cards to old cards, like it's not really you know, it's very heavily tilted in favor of what we've already seen. So we put all this time into...

...these lists and we perfect did these archetypes that maybe only gain one or two new cards, and sometimes in very small quantities, and so we have these kind of established cards and establish archetypes. Don't go too far away from those in initial testing because you need to get a feel for how the new cards not only interact with that in the deck itself, but how maybe a new archetype interacts against that to form a metagame. And what I'll say as well, till the expand upon that further, is there might be an existing deck that's like a staple deck and even benefits from a new set, that can't stand up at all to the new decks. But it's still worth it to start from there and realize, Oh, this is inferior to the new things. Let's build from there. Right, it's right always I think we're the starting point. Yeah, yeah, I think that's that's true to is like, and especially when you're looking to a new metagame, you know that not everyone is going to immediately shift over to the new stuff. So that's also something to keep in mind when you're building these decks. Is like. Does it stand up to what people have been playing? Because if people just pour over their old archetype that and your new archetype doesn't stand up to the old stuff, then you can really easily just cross that off your testing list. That's a very easy way to find out whether or not this archetype is still worth pursuing in the future. If it just doesn't stand up to a list that has already been played and has already been perfect acted, then there's no real reason to continue testing it, in my eyes exactly. So I want to build upon that a little further. Not really this specific question, but you asked about you know, you brought up examples of like the two week format or the darkness of blaze format. Are you going to mess around at all with the two EK format? Are you going to jump right in a rotation stuff? What's your plan? No, I'm going to test the two weeek format. There is a tournaments that is coming up in the two weeek format that is giving away cash prizing and I feel like this would just be a good opportunity. I've really wanted to compete competitively for the last month and I just haven't had that opportunity and so I'm excited to try the two week format. I do think that it's going to be Unorthodox. I do think, you know, just initially, that something like I really am fearful and am interested to see the types of Vika volt lists that come out. That, to me seems like the deck that has the most pre rotation potential in terms of it has electro power and it has thunder mountain and and, you know, it has all these tools that you can use to really buff Veka volt, and so that's the deck that I'm most interested to try. That's the deck that I'm most interested to find counters to. It might not end up being the best deck, but it certainly, for me, has a lot of kind of hype surrounding it in my in my eyes, and I think a lot of other players as well, but it just has these tools that it won't have post rotation so I really want to dig into the possibilities in this pre rotation format. Yeah, the pre rotation formats are always pretty crazy and it's kind of Nice that we have a tournament in that format, because what really sucks heading into actual worlds is when you get the set drop on TCG. Oh, but you can't actually play ladder or anything. Yeah, I remember being so upset about that last year. Yeah, there's like no value in playing on the ladder because everyone is just playing there for your rotation decks. It's like, what's the point here? Well, you do have those, you do have those good souls that go out there and do try to play post ratation. Know, bless their hearts, man, but bless their hearts, but I just playing on the ladder to try and find them is painful. For sure. You'll get like ninety percent through a game and then all like, the last game winning card is the card that's rotated. There's Oh, yeah, definitely happened a lot to be last year. That's really funny, but I got to you, guys. It's so the point is that it's cool that we're take, yeah, manage of this format. Yeah, I kind of liked when world's you know, I see arguments both ways, but I liked when worlds included like the free rotation format for the reason it just seems like a good summary of the season. Yeah, yeah, that's a really great point. Yeah, I was just going to use that word summary because it kind of gives us a little cherry on top. It really does feel like the format like doesn't shift entirely, but it just kind of adds a new color to the Palette that freshens things up for, you know, a couple weeks and then it's all gone and you know it's kind of this poof and this this cloud of of you know, kind of special miss that doesn't get too stale. You know, it's just very, very fresh. So I know, I kind of like this extra extra format. I think it adds a lot. Yeah, and I think there's still value in like the actual world's format being like post rotation. Dumb it. You know, it shows off some adaptability and how you're able to like...

...shift your focused. You know, sure, completely new metagame, but it's to me it seems a little odds because it's like not the same rotation that you had qualified two world's in. Right, right, yeah, that's like you know someone had played gotten all of their CP with the buzzle Gx Card or something, and you know, and that rotates, it's like, well, that's a bum. Sorry. Sure you can really be good with a specific archetype and then immediately see it go out the window, which I mean there are pros and cons to that, like we've outlined. But yeah, yeah, very quard really objectively good or bad? Are you planning on playing anything? Either pre rotation or post rotation? I'm sure post rotation with like tournament keys. I'm really excited to see how they work those into. Yeah, the client. But are you doing any pre rotation? Probably a little bit. I haven't experimented at all in that format. I don't have you either. Have you messed around with irritation in the pre rotation format? I've only watched videos, I've only really I've only really messed around with the post rotation. So it'll kind of be like a regression of thought process to but you know, with the TCO ladder as an option, it's pretty easy to dive into it. So there you go. There you go. Guys, remember to record your games right down your testing results. That will help you immensely. So let's open the floor up now to some viewer questions. Millennial three says. What DEX are Yall excited to play? Build from darkness ablaze, I said, Vika Volt Riley, is there one that you're particularly interested in playing? Yeah, I mean I've called out a couple of times that I am excited generally for a turn. It is because I like big bench decks. You know, those are got me my regional championship. Mega Ray was one of the most fun decks in my opinion. So I'm excited for a turn. Is I know it's like a vanilla answer, but it's it's super cool. Yeah, and then really outside of the realm of darkness ablaze, but more it's like things that are impacted by it. I'm excited to see the turbo patchen interacting with with old existing kinds of cards. Sure, and like what, you know, what are the cars that just need to like a little bit of a boost to be viable? Sure, I'm excited to like dig into those as well. Absolutely, I love finding, because I've a what's that? I love finding, like the niche little cards, you know. Yes, yes, be elzeboso says. What rotating card are you most relieved to see leave standard form. I think for me I cross moment. That's made the cross. That was a meme answer, I think for me actually it's Chirachi, prism star. That's like a little bit of an unorthodox answer, like I know that they're probably most realistically it's a job. When did drost you first of start come out so lust you'll store. Yeah, I think so. Anyway, it's gone. So that's the one that I most relieved to see standard. Believe in standard. That's so funny. I didn't even think about rage. For some star, if it's being a card that rotates right, honestly, for me it's probably Thunder Mountain. I hated that card, man. It just felt it made games feel so sacky, such a big swing and stadiums are always so unreliable to actually search and find. Yeah, and similarly electric power. I I just hated how much lightning got so much love at once and it was actually so frustrating to me. But didn't. I don't know, I never really truly dominant. I mean I don't know what you would consider domination. I feel I felt like a never truly dominated a format, like it was never and no, it didn't, I think, in a lot of players out it was never did have the IAD A format for it to be frustrating when Peakhurram just turned one hits like thunder mountain, three electric powers and knocks you out for and yeah, fair enough, sure enough. And that that's only enabled by like that, a mountain plus like cards like Thunder Mountain, electric power restrict I've talked about this a lot with like other cards, but like cars, like that restrict the design space that all lightning types can live in. You know, is they have to be balanced around cocoa prism, Thunder Mountain Combo. Sure, until they rotate. So sure, now I like you can actually open up the floor for like interesting lightning type cards that are entirely revolving around getting a bunch of energy on the board. Yep, which is what we seemed like every lightning card besides toxicity has been about getting as much energy on the board as possible. Pretty much. That's true, very true. So Guy Kid says, do you think a list of pond will be good? Yes, I'm a I'm a huge fan oficlist spot. I think that card is awesome. So it does. Thirty plus fifty for each V and Gx...

...on the opponent's side of the field. So you know, you're looking at these eternity stecks that might have, you know, a couple of turns down. They might have a couple of crow bats down and you're hitting you for good numbers therefore relatively cheaply. So I love the spot. I think they did, and they did an okay job incorporating some basic or some Non v Pokemon into this. Said, Glissa pod HOOPA greetent to an extent, Decidu, I like to an extent. Those both have, you know, very significant forms, but more high stools the Jire for a while. Well, it was really good. I think you just can't beat ATP, but it has a decent matchup spread. Yeah, you know, it just alot that. I'm not off it. It just it'll. I mean it really does depend on how big ATP is, because I think the list that Andrew created and that we tested on the stream was very strong. beat a lot of things. It just it can't beat fire, which I think that's a fine l to take. I don't know how big fire is going to be, especially in this kind of two weeek format. But then ATP is the real killer for that deck because you just can't beat ATP, sadly, and I think that makes the deck almost unplayable. There's so many decks there. That's like the death sence. Yeah, I'm lucky, the super unlucky, and that's another car that's like redistricted. The entire design space is ATP. Ye, ATP. Definitely. ATP definitely felt like the card that like should have rotated. Ironically, it came out like one of the latest cards in the block. Yea. Yeah, yeah, no, exactly. It just it feels like it's been in the format for so long and it's still going to be causing a lot of problems here and in future formats. It's I mean it's the kind of car that will cause problems until it rotates. Yeah, ATV is not even old at all. It came out at La. I see, remember that. No, I don't really did. I just don't. You remember all the height of elae? I see had the ATP Kel Dao's versus the the guzz Lord Nagonadels, and I was like the format and then those aren't one whole thing. Yeah, I do remember Chars Haard winning. I just don't remember a lot of hype for a TV very idea. Eighty fee was like the most played deck at it. I okay, so the process. So my problem is that oftentimes, like if I didn't play in that format, which I definitely did not play in that format, like I don't think I had a tournament in that format, I just will forget that existed. Like if it doesn't have a personal value to me, then I will just completely forget it existed. And I feel like I go through cards so fast and go through format so fast and I've been playing the game for so long that like my tiny little pe brain can only remember, yeah, you know, very specific formats that either like I did a very I had a very good performance in, or that I like tested a lot for, and that just wasn't one of those. So in my brain it kind of got lost. I think. I think the A, the cop out answers DIALGA is altering spacetime. It feels like it's been here for long. The yet really ATP still, you know, bothering me. It's mental now, though, that is making our perception of time seem incredibly long. Is that's writing the problem. So there you go. Answer solved. Derek and chat asking. Are there any meme decks that you will invest some time into? It depends on what the threshold for me is. I suppose I kind of mentioned earlier I want to play Santaconda colossal. I don't know if that extends all the way into meme or not. I think any time you're using a stage two to power up something is probably a me, at least right now. For sure. Well, it has a ability that's even remotely similar to strong charge, it's a meme. Like if your stage two ability is like deluge or something, maybe you can get away with not being a meme, but if it's something more cant to strong charge, I think you're doomed. Yeah, I'm excited, like we talked about in the earlier segment, just all the v Max has that now have a have a viable way to accelerate onto themselves that isn't like an attack, you know. I just think that that'll open up a lot of new possibilities for previously you know, they will probably still remain weak v Max has, but there are a few that I just really think can take advantage again of this rose engines at so meme, you know that would probably be the biggest meme is to try to make every single v Max deck work together. Yeah, yeah, Oh, yeah, together, yeah, we're sure, like a one one line or one one, one line of every single book ever created. This is what pokemon...

...intended. I think we found a perfect question to well, I have a second one of them. Will look back to it. Sir verseless and and chat. Ask. Do you think stage folk to Pokemon should be more powerful, maybe to a stand a bravely, but not enough to really knock out of be R GX? Yes, for sure. Stage welcome on our way too weak right now. The effort to put them out is not nearly worth the payoff forgetting it. Yeah, I know, she's actually absurd. The the cost reward there is so bad. Yeah, it's it's crazy that, like you look at Decidua, I think, is the Premier Stage two to come out of this upcoming format as a hundred forty health, which is you know that it which is half, which is half of ATP it just it's absurd. You know all the hoops that you had to go through to try to get these guys out and you don't really get much in return. It's the last question I wanted to cover is mask dave ass. Have you guys put any more thought into Stone Journey v Max with the Rose Engine? Very excited to start testing it once the set drops. And so astave, it sounds like you weren't here for the start of the cast because indeed JW Creey Wall has looking at Stone Jenner vbacs with the rose engine. I mean, you look at it into you know, two hundred damage, your one shotting a turn. It is your one shotting Vika volt, your one shotting peak Ram and ride shoe. Ride Shoe. You have a built in tank ability you. I don't know you have access to rose. It just seems like the pieces might be there for this sect it. I know it's I'm not trying to make like this big prediction on it because I could be completely wrong. We get the car. I haven't test been able to test this in the pre rotation format yet, but it just seems like a Combo that should work really well. I it seems like that's the Best v Max Pokemon and now the vmax Pokemon, the best fighting type V Max Pokemon. Yeah, it's a little sorry, correct. I think it's the best fighting type. v Max Pokemon and Now v Max is gets support. So if the metagame shifts more toward these fighting week attackers like Vika, volt and eternity is, then that should make a lot of room for stone journal broken. So if you take away anything from the cast to day, keep your friends close and your stone juniors closer. My name is Le Hobart, joined by J Vu creeball. Appreciate you all listening today and we'll catch you next time base say it.

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