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Tag Team Pokemon TCG Podcast
Tag Team Pokemon TCG Podcast

Season 2, Episode 23 · 1 year ago

2-23. Tabletop Simpulator

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

The boys are here to share their experiences in the infamous Tabletop Simulator. Don't worry, unlike the rest of your Pokemon Content this isn't a tutorial.

Everybody. Welcome back to tag team, the POKEMON trading card games for me or podcasting duo. My name isRiley Hulbert, joined by my good friend JW Curry. Wall JW. How'sIT hanging? It's hanging pretty well. I got some new blue like glasses, yeah, which my wife is very excited about. There from diff themaker is diff and apparently that's like the Tom's of glasses, because they likethey give a pair for every right, and so you you may know,my wife is like a super big craigslister facebook market placer, and so shegot these glasses for an insane deal when they normally like retail for like eightydollars. She's telling me I got him for fifteen, so pretty cool nice. Do you feel the difference, like when you're looking at screens? Ido. I had been wearing these blue like glasses, but she said theywere ungainly and definitely very orange and they kind of are like you know somewell, I don't know, I look like Dr Disrespect or something like that, but yeah, yeah, it's stands. The mustache leans a little bit intothe gamers own. I definitely a huge game. If I want tobe a Gamer, I wear these and then if I want to be,you know, a an insightful hipster, then I wear these. Do theyhave like similar levels of efficacy, like, do you feel like they prevent thestrain and about equal amounts, or is one better? Orth Um,I would just say that since it like it's a change of color, probablythe other one is feels a little bit different because it also like dims alittle bit, the orange colored dims. But yeah, yeah, I meanit's fine. I definitely do feel a difference just whether I wear these glassesor the other ones, just knowing that I can look at screens a littlebit more safely. Do you do you? Do you like sleep better after lookingat screens when you use these? Okay, actually had been before Igot the orange glasses, which were like maybe two or three weeks ago,like, I was finding actually I was getting kind of I spasms and thenI attributed it, right, because I was looking at a computer screen orsomething for, you know, most of the day. I attributed it tothe blue light from the computer and since getting, you know, a pairof glasses, I haven't noticed the twitch, so I must have been it.Yeah, I've been cured I know I have like trouble falling asleep whenI want to be using like my phone without the night shift is a goodexample. Like if I'm lying in bed just rolling through my phone, ifit's I'm if I'm using blue light, then I'm much more likely to stayawake than if I'm on the night shift the right on the IPHONE. Soyeah, no, I definitely noticed that too, but I always have usedtwilight or some other similar APP. Yeah, and I get rid of that basicallyuse flocks on my computer. Yeah, but then I start when I wheneverI do like graphic design stuff, you have to tear turn off fluxbecause your your sense of the colors is going to be off to what's actuallyon the screen. Right. So I ended up just like stop using flush. But it's great, it's a good piece of software, right, forsure. And then emmage sustained effect, right, you know. Yeah,but based on the time of day. Cool. Well, speaking of computers, lately, the the world of online TCG has really been expanding. Peoplehave truly for raid into the magical realm that is tabletop simulator. I feellike every day I see another youtuber trying to make a tutorial on how todo this simulator. I don't know what the deal with that is. Iguess they're just trying to hop on the trend. Sure, I mean it'sstill tabletop simulator. You know, takes some getting used to. I feellike once you actually get used to it actually feels like a pretty passable wayto play a card game. Yeah, it's okay, it's okay. Ithink the the kind of onboarding is a little bit difficult for some people.Yeah, but, like you said,...

...as soon as you get used tothe mechanics, you kind of see these certain things that, okay, thismakes sense because I've already used it in this application, and then if Ido it here, then okay, that that you know, I use thisalready to try to do this effect, but then it's very applicable over here. And so I think just the onboarding is very difficult, but as soonas you get into it, as soon as you get in a flow,it's really nice program yeah, I think that the place where tabletops in faltersright now, at least for pokemon cards. I think as a program it actuallydoes its job phenomenally well, but specifically for Pokemon cards, I thinkwe're struggles is with like weird pokemon cards like Marnie that like require this veryodd set of actions, like even within like a physical realm, like it'sodd. It's a Dumar. It's not a natural thing, definitely isn't.Yeah, I remember playing, you know, when we back when we had physicalcard tournaments, you know, playing the Marny and you're like you're tryingto pick up your deck and maybe you don't pick up the whole deck andthen you have cards like flying around. You know, are you like forgetto offer your your shark hands and components? You know, it's just all thisawkward stuff. Yeah, so like that part I understand. The otherarea, so, like any weird pokemon card interaction, it's just like verynontraditional like that. Yeah, the other area where I've seen difficulty it's justwith like energy specifically, or like things that get attached to pokemon. It'slike hard to stack them quite right. It's like it's like an art andyou get used to it. Yeah, for sure, I wish someone would, and I've thought about doing this myself. I think I mentioned this last weekof like maybe I maybe I just told this to Andrew, but Ihave thought about just as like a programming exercise to like try and do aMoD for a script. Yeah, I just like I just don't have thetime. You know, we were doing the hast a little bit earlier todayand I left work really late, so like I really got home about itlike twenty minutes ago. Yeah, so, I mean, regardless, I thinkit's a it's more than passable and I think, you know, that'skind of the foundation right now. We've had so many, so many formatsan now our people have done ridiculous stuff to try and do formats before theycome to tcgo. You know we do. We do skype sessions, we dolike tcg one, which, you know, that's probably my least favoritemechanism, like all this kind of crazy stuff, and I think tabletop Simis almost seems to be like the final form of that right. Absolutely,absolutely. Now, Riley, from a from a viewer perspective, how doyou feel like tabletop simulator, you know, compares to a real game of Pokemon? I mean, obviously it's worse, but how much worse, like areal life game of Pokmon? Yeah, I don't know. I think themost exciting way to watch pokemon is actually just TCGOH, like why?How you have animations and like you could set the movements are very smooth.I think there are notable pros and cons the tabletop simulator. I think overallit's like a worse experience than they know, like a traditional experience, just because, I don't know, maybe that's just like nostalgia, almost like anenjoyment of the physicality of cards. You know, that's that's part of thereason I like card games in general, to be honest, is like thephysicality holding cards and moving them around doing stuff with them, for sure.So that being said, I think there's some notable pros and cons. Theyou lose out on something like the player feeling, I guess, where youhave like physical people moving around and interacting with cards. But you gain yougain efficiency, at least in some areas, like shuffling is so streamlined, andthat's really the benefit of any online tool is that shuffling is streamlined.which is the most time consuming part of any card game is the shop rolling, especially in love like Pokemon or you shuffle a lot. Yes, notevery tcg shuffles as much as pokemon. Pokemon shuffle is an exceptionally large amountof times in a turn. That's right.

So that's right. Having it streamlinedis actually really nice, I think, on the whole. Actually, Iwasn't sure what I would feel about tabletop simulator like watching it. Ithink as people have gotten more familiar with it and it's been less painful tolike watch them go through interactions, it's got it's gotten at least okay.Like I think the only areas were really falters are like those weird interactions likeMarnie and and you know, things like great ball that like they's a littlemore effort full. I don't know, like it takes more effort to dothem. Then maybe I would take to see. But other than that,like I actually do enjoy watching it. That's good. That's good, andyou can tell, you know, kind of what the cards are and it'snot like hard to read. I guess. I guess that would be for me. The biggest thing is, like I get the comments where it's likehey, could you, you know, turn up the turn up the resolutionon the tabletop, but it's like no, that that's about where it is likegoing to be and you just, you know, it's kind of blurryand things like that. I'm wondering how that is for you. I don'tknow, like maybe I'm just familiar enough with the cards, but like,yeah, I tell you know, when I'm playing the game in real life, I look at the picture across from me. I don't read every singlething on my oppon its cards every single time. Like I know should knowwhat the card is. Yeah, when we go to world's we play,we look at the picture, you know, right, right. So, likeI don't see a problem. Yeah, no, it's definitely interesting. Howand I think that speaks to going off on a little tangent. Ithink that speaks to how a lot of players can get, you know,certain interactions wrong or certain card text wrong, because a lot of it is justthis this eyesight, you know, kind of yeah, looking at acard, you see, you identify the picture, you identify the color,the you know, the look of it, and then you go from there,right, and you just Oh, yeah, I assume that this doesthis or I assume that rice interacts with this and this way, and so, yeah, that's pretty interesting. Yeah, I think maybe that complaint is alittle amplified because of the fact that we're working like with new format cards. Sure it's like people might not have that level of familiarity. I thinkyou know, by and large there's not too many like there's actually a decentamount of stuff and darkness ablaze, but there's not a lot of like crazycomplicated stuff, and most of the stuff is like heavy hitter stuff that you'veprobably already seen, like yeah, I like these complicated card I'm sure youagree. Is a turn of this. You know, there's a lot goingon there. That's that's a real funny one because I've been doing some tabletops over the last couple of weeks with Andrew and that's probably the most likeasked question in the chat. is like someone will come in and one ofus is playing at turn it this and someone will say in the chat,like what's with your bench, like you're over bench, like I'm like no, no, it can. It can fit up to eight. So No, and we're having a really interesting conversation prior to the gas because we're trying. I was saying, I was musing at the idea of it turn itthis and like alternative ways to play, because I was at work today andI was walking to get food and I'm like, you know, I'd watchedit because I'd watched your video on Youtube. How like a turn it this islike overhyped slightly and the like. Yeah, man, it has tobe like some some way to play turn this. That is no one isseen through the glass, yet her see through the fog and I walking aroundlike man like. Couldn't a turn this just be like an optimal to hitKo deck versus other big polkes like you know, if you can't get theone hit Ko, the turn is could always guarantee you to AKA, whichnot every deck can boast that, and like and obviously you can win hitKo like anything under two hundred and seventy all right. And so I'm likethinking about this and thinking, thinking, like God, I wish there's away you could heal it and do all this kind of, you know,crazy fun stuff. And you brought up champions festival, and so we lookup champions festival. If you don't know Champions Festival is, it's a world'sPromo. It's a stadium and if you have a full bench, plus youactive Pokemon, then you can heal ten on your board. That's what weknew. The effect kill ten from. He'll ten from all of your poem. Yeah, so that was what we...

...had colloquially know the effective champions festivalto be, and this actually ties in like both kind of topics, likewherever you recognize like what the card generally does, as opposed to the wordsand the complicated nature of a turn, it is. So yeah, sowe're like, Oh, maybe we can use that to heal and we lookup champions festival and it says if you have six pokemon and play, thenyou can use it. And if you so, I guess you just can'tuse it with a turn. It is because you have more than six.I mean you could use it with the turn it is. You just haveto hope. We have to have six. Yeah, as you're like that's sobizarre and it's like I doubt they ever thought about that because there wasn'tany precedent for a larger bench size ability. There's pressent for like smaller bench sizeabilities and then there was precedent for like expanding your bench with like skyfield, for instance. But then if that was the play, then youwould never have champions festival, right. So so who is this bizarre?It's crazy. I really liked learning that though. Yeah, yeah, it'spretty cool. Kind of yeah, hold the new world's collide. Long StoryShort, we, I tried to think about a way to play attorney thisas were of a tanky to hi Kao deck, and I guess we didn'treally find anything fruitful, but it's a good thing to consider. Like yeah, I definitely, you know, I put out that video kind of sayinglike the counters to a turn it is and why it isn't. You know, maybe a it's not going to be the deck that just absolutely runs overmuch of the format like it does have. You know, it is a gooddeck. It is tier one in my opinion, but it's not likethe one. You know, it's not the be dif. I think thereare a lot of things that can go toetotoe with. But you bring upanother point, is like how will we see these lists evolve into the futureand what will they what will they look like? I mean we have thesereally nice baseless Andrew put out a very good base list of eternity is.I think there are a lot of good baseless out there for many of thearchetypes that come out of darkness a blaze. But how will we reimagine them asa format goes on. That's really exciting because we have this kind ofinitial thought and then, you know, you go and test that thought and, you know, modify and change it up and and then we come outwith a more developed format. I think that's really now or moving in.It almost feels, it's weird to say, like the set is, what,three weeks, four weeks away from dropping, and it's two weeks fromdropping, well, four weeks from being playable, I guess, but like, you know what is playable, you know, at this stage of thegame. Yeah, but that's why I'm saying is, like it's interesting.I feel like for this set we have more already in the time, inthe short time period, like we have more of a developed idea of whatthe format will look like in you know, so far, you know, passbeyond what am I trying to say, we have such a good idea ofthe format before the set even drops, like that we've had for any otherformat. I feel like I'd say yes. And now. I meannormally, you know, at on present day, we normally be talking aboutthe world's format. Right. Yeah, and I feel like we put alot of effort into our world testing at least last year and I feel likeyou, yeah, pretty close, besides the fact that we just didn't knowmew two was so good. Well, yeah, it was interesting, though, because we kind of picked a meme. Well, Planet Worlds. Well,it started as a meme and it developed into something much greater and honestly, I still say I'm by that. If, like, if we knewwhat we were doing with that, we could have definitely done better. Yeah, it's true. It's for sure true. It's for sure it was. Itwas still a little bit in the meme zone, but it was alsolike partially informed by all it. We thought that that it was going tolook like, which was incorrect because we weren't factoring in the welder decks tothe level that we should have. Yeah, absolutely, Non Greens water decks.That is absolutely so. It whatever. You know, bygones be bygones.We're talking about Guardi if you're not familiar, we play guardivoir at world'slast year. But what I'm saying is, like, I feel like this tyingus together. We had a what we thought was a good sense ofwhat the metal would look like, and it was correct for a large subsetof players. There was another subset of...

...players, which completely blew our ourminds, basically, about what we thought was realistic impossible for the format.We saw Pidgey, we saw like these welder mewtwo decks that were very straightforwardand very strong, obviously one tournament, and then we had like the fireboxx, which obviously were a staple for the entire rest of the year.Yeah, so, yeah, I guess what I'm ultimately saying is, don'tcount your chickens before they hatched, Mr Jw. Well, for sure.And then, I mean you look at at our position to and just beingcontent creators and being a kind of voices and just saying, like, wehave to make decisions at certain points, right, so, like you haveto make an opinion, you have to develop an opinion at this point.And so, yeah, of course, of course, like I'm always openand I've always said like the early opinions are some of the most fluid,right, in the sense that they can change the most. But I thinkthere are some things, some truths that have developed over the couple weeks thatwe've been doing tabletop and, you know, just theorizing on the on the newformat. I think one of those things is that ATP is still very, very good, and we were talking about like it dominated two formats agoand maybe wasn't as dominant this last format, although still had a very solid positionin the metagame. But I think it comes back into prominence because ofthe lack of one prize attackers like Spearit Tomb and baby blow Cephalon like thoseare baby blill ceplon still a deck, not saying that you know no onewill ever play baby blue cephalon and to an extent I'm sure spear tomb isa thing, but it's very obviously not the same deck that it once was. And so you look at the decline of those two decks and as forme being the reason that ATP just vaults itself into arguably the best deck inthe new format. So obviously ATP remains as like a powerful force. Itdoesn't really lose anything, and the fact of the matter is doing thirty moredamage and taking an extra prize when you have Zashan's in your deck is justgood. So that all follows logically, makes sense to me. In yourexperiences there anything that really consistently stands up? I mean I think you can makea case for a turn it is. But the weakness they're in a turnit is is that you're not quite on the same turn clock. Likeyou can't really guarantee wins in the same way that you can with ATP.The thing with ATP and the eternity this matchup is that you don't even haveto knock out in a turn it. You don't even have to hit intoan eternity is to win the game. Like you can just you can justdink around the attorney is go after two crow bats and that's the game.And like we were kind of talking about, well, maybe there's a way fora turn it is to you know, not bench as many robats, butthen of the point that you're not benching Crow Bats, you're not reallygetting the damage that you need to get out. So it's the good thiskind of tightrope here. It's not to say like that etern it is can'tbeat ATP, because it certainly can. I think that's the deck that goestoetotoe with it the best in the next format. Yeah, I'm curious whatkind of one prize solutions people will come with. I I feel like peoplealways start with these insane one fries decks and we get narrow them down tolike consistent masterpiece. I haven't really experimented with one prize, to be honest, in this format. Yeah, I've mostly looked at hern of this iskind of like my kind of deck. You know, fill your band.Sure, you know, travel a lot of I mean it's cool. Imean it reminds me a lot of like a I mean honestly, like asarc deck, like as ORC Sky Field Deck. Yeah, yeah, thelight way, not quite the flavor that that's our cat. Sure, sorry, you know, that's just, you know, like best flavor of alltime. But you know, it's it Harkens to it at least. Youknow, it gives you some of that satisfaction of hitting a lot of damagewith a large bench, having a wide bench. It's kind of fun,you know, like it is man like when you're like when you're pushing youropponents to both sides, you're like hey,...

...man, can I get a littleextra room? I got to put another zigzagoon down, you know.Yeah, and the facts for a zigzagoon makes it better for right. Thereyou go. So you know, it all follows. It all makes senseto me. Definitely. Does you know the other the other deck that I'vebeen really impressed within their early testing has been Decidu I. I think II knew Decidua I would be good to an extent, but kind of playingit as as the you know, essentially the egg round deck that we alljust wrecked regionals with, I think it has a lot of promise. Again, the one problem I would say with it is like it just has ahard time with ATP. You pretty much gotta lays option down, you gottaget, you know, a couple decidual I out and you're not doing enoughdamage quick enough to like take out the one prize threat that ATP could potentiallyplay. So that to me feels like a deck that if you can figureout attack or some way, some strategy to beat ATP, and that wouldbe for sure like a top tier contender. Yeah, right now probably falls inthat to your two category, but it's just something that I've been lookingat and saying, you know, this, this could actually work. This doeshave a lot more viability than maybe I initially thought. I thought itwas going to be good, I didn't think it was going to be asgood as it turns out it probably will be. Honestly, my initial impressionsof decidual I were bad. Yeah, gonna lie. Like the fact itwas on a stage too to get this ability when we've had, you know, similar decks on Basic Pokmon to do this and I didn't even like thosedecks. Right. So you know the shift and dynamic there and I don'treally know what's pushing decidual I. That didn't push those other decks when theywere quicker and more simple. But you know, I think the format isold as centered itself enough around these multi prize Pokmon that it just makes itan easy contender. You know exactly for sure. So not the kind ofdecks that I like, though. I just I hate playing this kind ofdecks, man it. It really sucks when you just hit like a onepriser that's plows through before you can do anything. Definitely, man, Itotally agree. I don't know, I hate my strategy being like Friday caddon my opponent not being able to do anything. Well, I know it'ssimple enough for some decks, including in not every day it works. Itworks a lot of the time, though. I gotta say, yeah, justlike the general strategy is never one that I've liked. You know,it's not so much like like you'll win with it. You'll play it ifyou if you, you know, felt like it was the best play forthe tournament. But right, you wouldn't never default to it. Yeah,I mean the only time I've really liked the deck like that, well,it's when I played the vioplume deck. Yeah, but you really liked thatdeck though. But yeah, a lot of thinking, you know, Iput a lot of time into that deck and like, yeah, it wasvery methodical and you know, it was also just like such an exceptionally obviouslygood play that it made sense to well and your and just so listeners know, you're talking about the colloquially named colloquially named whacky smacky, that's correct.Yeah, which is a mill deck, stall deck, focusing around, youknow, Reggie Gigas and has A. was it a? I mean itwas a what three hundred and three vio plume or something like that. It'sthree little bit sicker, two hundred and two. Three out two. Oh, three out two, okay, yeah, yeah, three out two, vioplumline, blocking the basics from attacking. So just kind of this wall deckthat you could put up anything to respond to your opponents and just eventuallymill them out. The SANCHO Villa rings up in chats. Not The shiftgears too hard from Bile Pluma stands for villa. Brings up an interesting point. If you're worried about any fighting decks in terms of a turn to this, you know, the only one I've even seen like worth being time atall. It's been like, I don't...

...know, say it. Say it. Do I even say my worm, Bro, what's that? Diving?Given a platform? Bro, say it. I can't. Man, I've diedover the Pacimian rabbit hole once and now. Clearly the deck that he'stalking about is X. Couldrill, true, true, extra drill. That's morefun, though. Now. Yeah, actually drill the philanx failings. Yeah, no, like, and I was actually a big Pacifian stand likewith the deck. First became like a real thing when Kevin Baxter played itto top thirty two. I had worked on that so hard with him headingin. That's what I just didn't play it. So I'm know, I'mwith you. Failings, people who like are about that, like I knowthat. I know the vibes. Right, I'm run with the vibes, butright, JE's there. This kind of decks just the worst. They'repretty bad. I feel so bad to play. Are Pretty late. They'reawful, man like. Yeah, I don't know if you would in termsof being worried about any fighting decks. I mean fighting were at least rightnow, until we have colossal is not a tier one deck at it's simplyrelegated to being a counter deck solely based on having the weakness on a turnitis. And then again, I mean a turn it is, like wehave previously stated, isn't the, you know, catch all best deck inthe format. In my opinion, maybe it turns into that. I don'tthink so. There are a lot of ways that can be countered and somebad matchups that are already kind of showing up in the testing and and so, you know, fighting is only relevant because of turn it is and isrelevant and it turn it, this may not be like the best deck thatwe thought it would be. You know, are crazy, crazy, be difor something like that. And so, unfortunately, fighting next, I wouldn'tworry if it turn it is becomes insane, you know, if somebuild comes out or we just find that, hey, it turn it, thisis actually the best deck after more testing, more reps. you know, you can always include weakness pot are weakness card energy, right, ifit's in right into that colorless energy slot. Yeah, so it really isn't thatbig of it. Like there is a counter that it turn it ishas to these fighting decks. And again that's not like a perfect counter,but in the sense that you could always with the energy attachments or not haveit on the right pokemon or they could gust around it, but there isthat answer that you can play that should help you in a fighting matchup.Yeah, yeah, it's just my kind of logic. It's almost like thesame reason I don't like playing the counter ish decks like the Hoopahs and theand inciduise is the same reason I don't like playing he's like weird weakness decks. It's like you're trying to do one thing right and if your opponent asa way around that thing or you don't hit the right matchups, like what'seven the point? Yeah, and none of the fighting decks, I don'tthink our stand enough, stand up well enough on their own to to justifyplaying them. And it's it Harkens back to pursue me and again, likebecause if passilian truly wasn't a viable degg when Zark what dominated the entire format, why would now failings be a deck when we're not sure that a turnit is is even the best egg? Right, right, and I meanand you look at failings to like it has less tools, I feel,like them Passimian had in terms of sir counter attackers and counter attackers and thingslike that. Right, right. So it's really just it's kind of thisone track mind that I'm not really seeing having a lot of other good matchesoutside of like maybe peek around, but obviously we're talking about next format.So lightning isn't a factor either. So yeah, I think you could makean argument for philanx in the kind of the the world's format, of theweird, the lost format, where it's ultraprism to darkness ablaze. You couldmaybe make a case for failings, but...

...the Leond that beyond that it's hardto say that that that will be much of a factor. has anyone likein chat put any creed into the lost format, the TCG Oh format,for like to two weeks that? Well, I mean there are going to betournaments run in that format outside of like some grass roots ones. Yeah, grass roots tournaments can interesting. So yeah, I mean that is goingto be like the TCGO standard as well for two weeks. I think it'llbe fun. I'm really looking forward to Vika volt actually, because that thatto me, like Vika volts. I think it's going to have a hardtime without something like thunder mountain or something like counter gain, and I thinkif it has, you know, some way to make it so that you'reonly attacking for one energy, that's kind of what it needs. If Kavolt still feels like it has a place in the post rotation format. Butunfortunately, Losing Thunder Mountain, I think it's too big of a loss forVika volt to be, you know, to be like a top TI.I again, like a probably a tier two deck, is a vehic Volein post rotation, but losing out on that one energy attack possibility is hugefor that day. Yeah, if only there is a way to attach toenergy with single attachment. Man, if only. Can you imagine such athing? That would just be actually just a broken card. I feel likethat should never be printed. That would totally imbalance cards that are yeah,right, right, the Tas, yeah, or if they made something like that, maybe it just goes away after the turn is done, or it'slike only limited to certain Pokemon, maybe not the most powerful ones. Yeah, that's they'd have to do something like that, right. Yeah, Ithink they would have to write to make it a balance card. So anyway, well, we'll get back to the DEV team on that one. Youknow, I was I was never in tea and DC is inherently broken.I was on team the cards that had DC cost or broken. Yeah,I don't think I was there too. Yeah, I was there too.I was like, I was more of a fan of banning sky field.No, honestly, I mean like, but like seismtoad to I mean you'reright. Yeah, you look at seismotoad or like even laser. Like Ifeel like seismitoad without laser isn't that bad? I mean we look at it herein the future format where you have Veka vol the seven shotting and aturn it is or seven shotting pretty much any other vmax right now. That'sTimes. Seismtoad was six shot usually. Yeah, six shot generally. Orif I had like a fighting for your belts and like, I mean it. Did you know the math gets a little bit funky and verbank and youknow, there's some other factors that you can consider there. But yeah,there's no real good. I guess you could play vitality band and the vehiclelesand that lesson. Then you got Ziga. Okay, I digress, but itis a lot easier for sizem story to hit, you know, getcleaner knockouts than it is for beatable rights. Big. Yeah, when I goit comes to DC, my like thought, and I'm sure this wasthe balance team's thought, was like, you know, it's a good wayto bridge attack that's too powerful for one basic energy, a two week fortwo basic energy. Yeah, and I just think ultimately like they didn't hitthat middle ground quite right where the attacks REDC you were just way too goodto write to justify not doing it, you know, right from so,you know, maybe one day DC comes back. I was A had aglorious run, right, exactly. Cool. Yeah, well, I think Ithink now's the time we can open up the floor to any of yourquestions. If you guys have any questions. We do want to talk about oneother thing today. Yeah, of course we did want to talk aboutour experiences and tabletop simulator with the cubes.

Yes, yes, now, thecubes are something very cool. I haven't actually participate in one. Tonightwill be the first time. I'm hoping that, you know, everyone willbe cool with me streaming it, because I think I'd like to show how, you know, a cube can work in this format. I other peoplehave streamed it, but it's certainly cubing in real life is like one ofthe best ways to enjoy pokemon in my personal opinion, because there's a camaraderieto it that, I don't know, you don't really get in any othersituation. Like, like everyone, it's lower stakes than a tournament, becauseI think Camaraderie is there in tournaments. But the problem with tournaments is thatnot everyone's going to do well. So you know, some people are goingto be small te you know some people are going to be, you know, upset or frustrated that they miss played or something like that. But thenin a cube it's so low low steaks that everybody is just enjoying pokemon inhis purest form, and that is one of the greatest things about cues.Yeah, I love like the drafting phase and like talking trash and all yourfriends, you know, just flipping your shirt off after like ten consecutive babyflips and flinging it around in the air, something like, something like that.You know, I don't know who would do something crazy like that,but I've enjoyed them. What's cool about tabletop Sim is they are some pluginswhich, you know, I don't have to make them, like someone elsehas already made them, where you can like automatically pass the hands around.Yeah, I'm like, building the deck isn't too bad. And I actuallyI have that experience even before I played the Cube, because I was playingbunny kingdom on tabletops. That okay and like yeah, you know, that'salso a drafting game and they had the same like pass the hand around button. Yeah, so you know, I think actually it's systematically works pretty well. As long as you have a group that as a whole understands, theywill top them, you know, because one person really control the slowest personin a cube controls the pace of the queue, you know, yes,the entire group. So you know, having everyone in the same page asfar as like readiness is is obviously key. But you know, once you getthat narrowed down, it's pretty good it's pretty good, dude. It'sgood. It's good. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I've enjoyed it. Andwhat's cool is, like it's really easy to that dynamically updated cube withany card. Yeah, because, yeah, because that's one of the things too, is like with the fiscal cubes, you know, you might have overpoweredcards, but then you're like, well, you know, if Iwant to play this again and, you know, buff up this typing orbuff of this archetype, like, I'm going to have to wait a littlewhile. The like order the cards and you might not have the things thatyou need on hand. But with a cube and tabletop simulator, just gohey, I want more of this card, clone it, boom, it's there. You know, it's immediately there. That's very cool. Yeah, let'syou have really dynamic ability to change things and and alter things and rebalancetypes, and I like that a lie. It's a it's like a good mediumto experiment as well, like, even in a future state where everyone'sback to normal, like maybe you're thinking about doing, a cube is agreat way to test it out and see if, like, it's balanced orif you need to rethink things. It's they get expensive too, especially fordoing older formats? Oh for sure. These cards get really expensive over time. So you don't want to drop money on an archetype. That just doesn'twork right. Right, and that's that's also another thing too. is likeif you are thinking about getting into cubes, like starting as soon as possible.It would be my would be my advice, because the lawer, youwait, I mean, we're just seeing the card prices go in sanely high, like I never thought, you know, some of these primes would get overten or fifteen bucks, but here they are, you know, andit's absolutely insane. Some of these literally unplayable cards, like never saw asingle tournament play in their entire lifetimes, like, are now skyrocketing. Yeah, likes, I thinks one over a hundred bucks or something like which.One light drag nights over a hundred dollars. Light Dragon night is one hundred dollarsmore than unbelievable. They're listed.

So you know, this is importantebay trick. If you're everybody bay. The listing price isn't necessarily the valueof a card. You want to look at like the recent sales, andso they have sold from anywhere from like a hundred two hundred eighty dollars inthe last couple days. Wow, that's crazy, man. And like yeah, and like somebody like Andrews, like he has like for something in hiscube, something like that, where he you know, he probably picked themup for ten or fifteen apiece. But just looking at it, like thecard prices have gone absolutely insane, like the Primes I've been looking at.I don't know, it's really spurred it on either. I feel like thisis almost a weird time to get into it. Yeah, it just seemslike new money is coming into the end of the game. Somehow people arelike more than home and just want to collect or well, and I alsofeel like big money is coming into the game. That's I mean, we'vehad some big movers and shakers in the Pokemon community, but certainly not youknow. Oh well, I mean, and maybe this this could be aclueless I am, but so like certainly not like millionaires, which I almostfeel like at this point there has to be some guy that just has somuch money that he has no idea what to do with. He's literally buyingup everything. That's what it feels like, because these cards that shouldn't be asexpensive as they are are super boosted in price, like not even justlike Oh, I'm noticing a difference, like they're inflating by two, three, four five times what they were worth not even six months ago. Yeah, and that is absolutely absurd. So, yeah, I mean to bring itback to the cube, like, if you want to start a cubewith older format cards, either do it in tabletop simulator because, like Rileysaid, that's a good way to test and figure out like what you actuallywant to buy. But if you're thinking about doing something, I would juststart now, because those old cards are not going to go down anytime soon. I mean there is a bubble, there's bubble speculation. That's a wholenother podcast. There's bubble speculation on the price of cards, but at leastfor now, for this foreseeable future, they should be and they definitely won'tgo down to where they were, you know, a year ago or twoyears ago. So certainly get in now if you if you're interested in makinga cube. Yeah, awesome points, and who knows, maybe the investmentpodcast is coming next. Well, let's stump in a chat questions here.I see a couple already. Guy Kid one to one, asking will blowndsbe good. Post rotation. Jw Thoughts blonds is fine. Any time thatyou're looking at a one prize attacker that can one shot anything, I thinkthat has like an inherent amount of value in this form, in a formatin terms of like we're just seeing the HP go go to a scale thatwe've never seen before, but at least there's kind of this check, youknow, in some way that we have in our in our baby blue cephalon. And so I wish that it had one more buff. It loses heatfactory, it loses primarily the fire crystal. I wish it just had that oneor not fire crystal, fiery flint right the fun. I wish itjust had that one extra buff, like fiery flint was back, or likeeven professor's letter, just to give it a little bit more, because rightnow it doesn't feel like it has enough. You're going to lose to a lategame N or like game reset stamp, excuse me, or like a Marniway harder than you did in formats past. And so that is thethat is the most concerning thing to me about baby blue cufflon. Awesome deckshould be, you know, viable, but it won't sniffed here one withoutsome kind of buff. Yeah, I agree. I think the hardest partis having like a lowhand cost way to get a lot of energy to yourhand. You know, the giant Earth is not quite as effective as havinga fiery flint, and so the deck is a little bit stifled in itsway to get out of the gate,...

...yeah, initially, and then alsoto keep it going. Yeah, and so it's just it's that's like amajor, major loss. Is the flint. Honestly, like every time I playedthe deck I've loved having Flints in my hands. I love drawing them, I love continuing to draw them, like sure, early, mid late. It's just a good car. So sure, yeah, you know exactly, is it? The deck still has the tools. If you can getenergy into the discard, like you still have the waist. Yeah, cyclethem over and over. It's just, yeah, I mean for sure,and like Guy Kid says, lucky egg and like spinner for getting energy out. Like spinners good, don't get me wrong, they're but like the bestcase of spinner is to use it on the second turn. But since you'rea lot slower, you're never really using spinner to like it's full effect,like right, like you're not going to get that many spinners as well,like right, like not just not even thinking about like late game not beinga good card to draw, like I'd rather draw an energy almost that aspinner. M Yeah, in certain cases for sure. You know, it'sjust like why am I playing a spinder? But I could just have an endat that point. You know I'm saying this. But, like,you know, the the turn to value. If you're thinking about you know,maybe you go second and just try to get an explosive turn to youknow, what are you going to draw? Like three spinners, like okay,right, you know, if you do that, you know you're reallyfreaking plain that one. Well, you're sure. You know you have wehave one welder. You drop threes of itters. Yeah, yeah, thelate game, the late game with blounts is very different now because you relysolely on your fire crystals to get you those one hit Ko numbers. Soyou need to have enough fire crystals left in the deck to achieve, youknow, against vmax decks to one shots, which isn't always that viable because inthe early game, you know you might have the discard one like tryto go for a dedne or you maybe have used one in the early gameto try to get something set. It just is a lot better in theorythan I think it is in practice, and I think we'll see that playout. blounds not dead again, not saying it's like the not saying it'shorrible, not saying it's unplayable, just saying it's not as good as itwas, which is I mean it's natural, which is pretty obvious, I guess. Yeah, you know, fits in, makes sense. Yeah,merciless. asking any thoughts on a ground with the sturdy ability and sturdy buildis another one that I've ever been a fan of just like that. Well, I think you look at a sturdy ability being something that's okay. Wesaw it with, I think Donphan was the card in like loss under orsomething. One of the Games changed since then in the fact that we havea lot of decks playing scoop up nets and Zix ACO. Yes, andI was just going to say there's that and then there's also a problem witha ground being not only being a stage to making it just a little bitharder to get out than Don Fan, but also the problem that you don'thave a healing mechanic that will heal a hundred and fifty damage a consistently.We had last last change dance potion, right, which is very good forDonphan, because down pin had like a hundred twenty or a hundred thirty health, and so last chance potions filled it all the way to full. Soyou look at that like, oh, that's a good Combo, like thatactually works. But like with Donphan or with Agron, you would need toget a last chance potion and a potion and then, like I'm alone Laana, or like a last chance potion and then a potion, and it justthat that extra combo is what's gonna you know, if it wasn't good already, like that extra bit of Combo isn't going to help. What's that?The last chance potion come in? I couldn't tell you, man, Idon't know either. I guess I'll look it up here. You can addressedthe next question. What is the next question? Or is there not anext question? Oh, celestial storm flush still store. WHO WOULD HAVE NOT? Who would have thought? CYANURA? Sorry, that slush. You'll startwith such an underwhelming he said that last chance potion in it. Bro lastchance potion, top tier contender. I...

...didn't even know last chance potion haslike as to dune bars on it. Did you know that? No,yeah, has to done spars on the sides. Huh, you'll learn somethingnew every day, you sure do. One last question from the Keel inchat. Any thoughts on the UPPAH deck? Does it still like Guzma and isthat prevent it from being good? I think you actually have enough switchwith the hide energy and the air balloon that it's probably fine. The problemwith Hoopa is that the damage output just lacks a little bit. With Zaptos. The reason that's aptos was, you know, very strong and like tierone deck is because the HP was a little less back then. You weren'tlooking at, you know, Vmax Pokemon, and then you also had the additionaldamage buff of electric power, and so that's not again. That's notto say like Puppah is bad. I think it is a good card,but I don't think it can be a deck on its own because it's goingto need some like additional damage. Now you might maybe there's a way todo like Hoopa plus like sable I or something as like a as, likethat backup sweeper, but just doing ninety damage turn after turn isn't gonna isn'tgoing to do it for you, I think in the long run, especiallyagainst these massive v Max's. All right, how I would frame it is,you know, Zaptos is a deck had two things that really we're goingfor it. The first was Goozma, which was ridiculous. Yeah, thesecond one was it threatened a to hit Ko or a one hit ko oneverything pokemon. We're smaller back then. Eighty damage itself was already good andthen, you know, taking the next step from that is you threatened thatKoh, even a one hit Ko on a lot of pokemon. So Ithink loose using the losing the guaranteed Gust plus, which obviously hurts any deckwith that, that strategy of, you know, pivoting around and doing damage. It's by virtue of pivoting, sure. But then, just like GW said, the the damage output being so threatened buy the electric power not existingfor dark types. Nor should it right that. I it's not an archetypethat I would pursue. I mean it'll be fine again. It's it feelsa lot like a baby bill stuff on deck, like just not quite there. But maybe someone you know Nikiel's bringing up the Larre and you know,maybe that's the maybe that's the state of one dries decks right now. Idon't know. Yeah, I mean there's still a lot to a lot tofigure out and again this is the exciting time. So we kind of havethis framework, framework that's been built, the foundation for the format has beenbuilt, a lot of good lists of been coming out and now we getto build upon that and see what what can stand a chance. Yeah,I'm excited to see how everything pans out. Lord knows, we get surprised allthe time with how people might approach a format. So I'm excited tosee what surprising things come out of this, what developments we get over the nextfew weeks and what you all from chat come up with. So onethey stend. A hearty thanks to everyone in chat today. Want to thankAndrew Mahone and it's will Garcia Griego for the raids. We appreciate all youcoming from those channels and we will certainly be catching you all next week.Peace. See You.

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